Why is Banjo Kazooie considered better than the Spyro games?

[Leon]

I think that the PS1 captured a big demographic of teens and stuff who weren't really "gamers", but who dipped in and out of it as something to kill time. You know, the sorts of people who have a PS1/2 to play like football games exclusively.

In fairness, I'm sure that a chunk of those same people probably dipped in and out of the more popular mainstream titles in the PS3/360 era, but like you say, they're probably not invested enough to be on a site like RGT lmao

The ps1 had alot going for it, first off it was cheaper than the competition and beat the n64 by what, 2 years?
The second fact is because it used cd's not only did it allow for music playback but it also allowed for cheaper games, that drove up adoption significantly.
Finally the system came out at the perfect time, the mid 90's saw a economic boom across multiple nations that meant people tended to have a bit more money in their pocket to spend on non-essentials.

 

[Mytra2004]

Hello guys. I'm really late for this discussion but for me specifically i prefer a lot more the Spyro games over Banjoo-Kazooie (i did not played Tooie so i'm not gonna talk about this one). I will give my reasons why and specifically why i consider the spyro trilogy a masterpiece.

First, about B&K, i consider this game a really solid one, but i don't find myself revisiting it as much as other Nintendo games, and the reasons are not fault of the game but rather personal bias. Examples include:
> I'm not a big fan of the different forms banjoo takes collecting skulls, it's pretty unique and the bee form is cool, but i did not liked.
> Some stages are pretty confusing to navigate because it emulates the feel of Mario 64 but traverse some parts are not as fast as the former.
> The characters are really nice but i did not find any of them truly stand out in the game (i know this sound a heresy for the fans)
> The final boss is pretty frustanting, almost made me quit the game.

Now about Spyro, i think the exploration is amazingly solid in all games. The first one is the most simple but the pure platformer is fair and challenging without dragging out the game. Ripto's Rage introduces new stuff that makes all the worlds more vividly. Collecting the crystals is more fun than the dragons in the first one because the levels have a lot of personality, and the minigames (or sections where the gameplay differ a bit of the normal platforming) is solid with a feel problems. And Year of the Dragon is honestly a masterpiece. All levels are unique and fun, the new cast of characters not take to much of the spot from spyro and also they had variety in each stage they appear. The minigames are good too and for me is my favorite of the three games.

 

[trickybus]

the system came out at the perfect time, the mid 90's saw a economic boom across multiple nations that meant people tended to have a bit more money in their pocket to spend on non-essentials.

Out of curiosity, I popped over to YouTube to see how many 90s commercials of each game—just the first ones, not the sequels—I could find and discovered that it heavily skews towards Spyro. I found animated TV spots, live-action ones and a couple of spots on Cartoon Network's Toonami. I've probably seen more than a few of these as a kid but forgot about them as time went on. I wonder how much the marketing for these games affected the general perception both then and now.

Another cool little trivia bit is that some of Spyro's live-action commercials has an animatronic sheep called Toasty protesting the game. For the uninitiated, Toasty is a boss in the first Spyro, so the implications are that he's mad at Spyro and trying to get revenge by tanking his game sales

 

[Mago]

Out of curiosity, I popped over to YouTube to see how many 90s commercials of each game—just the first ones, not the sequels—I could find and discovered that it heavily skews towards Spyro. I found animated TV spots, live-action ones and a couple of spots on Cartoon Network's Toonami. I've probably seen more than a few of these as a kid but forgot about them as time went on. I wonder how much the marketing for these games affected the general perception both then and now.

Another cool little trivia bit is that some of Spyro's live-action commercials has an animatronic sheep called Toasty protesting the game. For the uninitiated, Toasty is a boss in the first Spyro, so the implications are that he's mad at Spyro and trying to get revenge by tanking his game sales

View attachment 90666 View attachment 90667

I forgot about that Sheep lol!

 

[Anti-Law Savior]

IDK but I play them both, well a little more Spyro than Banjo but I think that's because I grew up with playing Spyro games, and the only chance I got to play a Banjo game is when I stared emulation.

 

[MidnightKittehBoi]

I think Rare where really on the ball with game design at the time, had such awesome teams that the games are still vastly popular today. Banjo is the only game I have repeatedly beaten over and over every couple of years. Goldeneye is always fun to return to and even trying out some of the mods. I have tried playing Spyro and it does not control as well even with Xbox controllers. Mario 64 also does not measure quite up to Banjo on controls which only got better with Banjo Tooie even if the game was more drawn out.

 

[Mago]

I think Rare where really on the ball with game design at the time, had such awesome teams that the games are still vastly popular today. Banjo is the only game I have repeatedly beaten over and over every couple of years. Goldeneye is always fun to return to and even trying out some of the mods. I have tried playing Spyro and it does not control as well even with Xbox controllers. Mario 64 also does not measure quite up to Banjo on controls which only got better with Banjo Tooie even if the game was more drawn out.

I'm not trying to tell you you're opinion is wrong, but it's baffling to me that anyone would say Banjo controls better than Spyro or Mario 64.

 

[UnemployedandMessy]

I Love Both.

 

[trickybus]

I have tried playing Spyro and it does not control as well even with Xbox controllers

Okay, I have to ask because I'm having the opposite experience: what does "good controls" mean to you?

Edit​

Actually, since I'm asking, I'll offer my own POV first. The first thing is input latency. Banjo-Kazooie has it and screws me up when I'm trying to make simple jumps due to how much delay there is between pressing the button and Banjo actually jumping. The most common scenario is I'll attempt to jump from the edge of a platform only to run off it because of the input latency. I even had my friend try it out and he did the same thing at the same platform.

Second is underwater diving. It just sucks. There's no way to quick turn so when you inevitably swim into a dead end to get a collectible, you have to slooooooowly turn back around to try getting back before Banjo drowns. The other thing is the swim speed. Even underwater, Banjo moves like molasses. Kazooie's swim strokes are great for distance but make it easier to overshoot the destination. I would accept this as a trade off for going faster except the swimming experience is already terrible. I abuse Kazooie's speed mostly because I want to get the fuck out of water as fast as possible.

Finally, the special moves. To use the majority of them, I need to crouch as Banjo first. Two button presses at minimum. When I breathe fire with Spyro? One button. When I charge/headbutt with Spyro? One button. Holding that button makes the charge attack continuous which has the added benefit of giving me an another movement option that doubles as an attack. Then the second game added a double jump that acts similar to Yoshi's flutter jump. About to land on a platform and might just miss it? Pop the extra jump for a little more height and just make it. And because Spyro only hops up a small amount, it's not an ability that comes with built-in cheese (that's the charging pads).

I cannot overstate how much Spyro's movement just works and doesn't distract me from the core game with how janky it is.

 

[MidnightKittehBoi]

Okay, I have to ask because I'm having the opposite experience: what does "good controls" mean to you?

Edit​

Actually, since I'm asking, I'll offer my own POV first. The first thing is input latency. Banjo-Kazooie has it and screws me up when I'm trying to make simple jumps due to how much delay there is between pressing the button and Banjo actually jumping. The most common scenario is I'll attempt to jump from the edge of a platform only to run off it because of the input latency. I even had my friend try it out and he did the same thing at the same platform.

Second is underwater diving. It just sucks. There's no way to quick turn so when you inevitably swim into a dead end to get a collectible, you have to slooooooowly turn back around to try getting back before Banjo drowns. The other thing is the swim speed. Even underwater, Banjo moves like molasses. Kazooie's swim strokes are great for distance but make it easier to overshoot the destination. I would accept this as a trade off for going faster except the swimming experience is already terrible. I abuse Kazooie's speed mostly because I want to get the fuck out of water as fast as possible.

Finally, the special moves. To use the majority of them, I need to crouch as Banjo first. Two button presses at minimum. When I breathe fire with Spyro? One button. When I charge/headbutt with Spyro? One button. Holding that button makes the charge attack continuous which has the added benefit of giving me an another movement option that doubles as an attack. Then the second game added a double jump that acts similar to Yoshi's flutter jump. About to land on a platform and might just miss it? Pop the extra jump for a little more height and just make it. And because Spyro only hops up a small amount, it's not an ability that comes with built-in cheese (that's the charging pads).

I cannot overstate how much Spyro's movement just works and doesn't distract me from the core game with how janky it is.

I grew up on Banjo Kazooie and find all of those controls quite easy to me while the spyro controls I still get confused with the buttons at times. Though could just be me tbf.

Post automatically merged: Sunday at 11:42 PM

I'm not trying to tell you you're opinion is wrong, but it's baffling to me that anyone would say Banjo controls better than Spyro or Mario 64.

It was far better than Mario 64 which could be extremely finicky at times especially for me. The controls for Banjo and Kazooie just gelled that much easier.