Thoughts on the Odyssey?

[CrunchyComputer]

Apologies, here I was thinking retro gamers might be able to look beyond visuals. Silly me.

And they should, I agree. Look at the original Clash of the Titans, fully 100% practical effects, stop motion, no CGI, no anything they couldn't do by hand. It is still a thousand times better than half the slop Hollywood excretes or has in the past 20 years.
Ray Harryhausen, to this day, is underrated, in my opinion.

But you got this part right, she actually looks like an otherworldly being.

Absolutely.

Whereas I wouldn't look twice at Zendaya walking down the street.

Zendaya, is far from a beautiful woman. I don't care what color her skin is, that has nothing to do with it. She is absolutely not attractive in any way, shape, or form

Isabella always strikes my brain in this odd way, because I've seen so many of her mother's films. So there's already this uncanny feeling like she's Ingrid Bergman reborn.

Well, Isabella Rossellini had an otherworldly beauty that is long gone in this day and age. She was just as beautiful as a woman, and her acting wholeheartedly shone through, showing how talented she was. In my opinion, she was what women should strive for now, beauty wise.

 

[Strategist Strategist]

To be fair to Nolan

Spoiler: Nolan Odyssey Spoilers

Zendaya isn't technically Athena, but a Troyan priestess of Athena he saw being killed during the sacking of Troy and he confuses her for Athena in his dreams.

 

[CrunchyComputer]

To be fair to Nolan

Spoiler: Nolan Odyssey Spoilers

Zendaya isn't technically Athena, but a Troyan priestess of Athena he saw being killed during the sacking of Troy and he confuses her for Athena in his dreams.

Fair, but Zendaya is still a Shit actress.

 

[Strategist Strategist]

Fair, but Zendaya is still a Shit actress.

I've already said I'm not a fan of the casting, but they are objectively speaking the most popular hollywood actors of our era. Maybe they could've thrown in some more unknowns to balance things but they went with name value.

 

[CrunchyComputer]

I've already said I'm not a fan of the casting, but they are objectively speaking the most popular hollywood actors of our era. Maybe they could've thrown in some more unknowns to balance things but they went with name value.

Yeah, they could have. I honestly think a group of unknowns from a high school theater club would have been better. But no, as much as they spent on this absolute failure, they wanted the names to try and put butts in seats, and they failed.

No, I'm fully with you here. I know Hollywood only hires big names for something like this, and in their position, any of us would do the same. I'm not dogging Hollywood for that. I'm dogging them for the lack of vision and being too scared not to toss in the current thing for an audience that isn't there.

 

[WeAreAmalia]

The best way to experience the Odyssey is to read it aloud (in proper Dactylic Hexameter) while your identical twin performs an interpretive dance.

If you can't manage that, you don't deserve to read Homer. Go watch Love Island or something, silly peasants.

 

[Retro Doomer]

I don't think about it

but its very very bad and that's it, its so bad I barely care for it I care more for dry paint than this
''Movie''

this word gets overused but well what are we supposed to do when woke slop after woke slop comes out.

 

[Strategist Strategist]

I don't think about it
View attachment 213255
but its very very bad and that's it, its so bad I barely care for it I care more for dry paint than this
''Movie''

this word gets overused but well what are we supposed to do when woke slop after woke slop comes out.

I thought you were better than this, bud. You felt for the slop rage bait. It is definitively not a bad movie.

 

[Heidegger of Shinra]

I thought you were better than this, bud.

Implying that your view is better than the people who disagree with you?
Do you think everyone who dislikes the movie is regurgitating ragebait?

 

[Strategist Strategist]

Implying that your view is better than the people who disagree with you?
Do you think everyone who dislikes the movie is regurgitating ragebait?

Well when you post other people's ragebait without any opinion of your own then that is the conclusion I will reach. Woke is not really a substantive criticism of a film's quality, in my estimation. Its just a nebulous term rage baiters use to hate on things they don't like for one reason or another.

Like say what you like or don't like about the film with your own words and without using meaningless drivel like "woke". You might find out in the process that your argument simply isn't that well thought out.

 

[Heidegger of Shinra]

Well when you post other people's ragebait without any opinion of your own then that is the conclusion I will reach. Woke is not really a substantive criticism of a film's quality, in my estimation. Its just a nebulous term rage baiters use to hate on things they don't like for one reason or another.

I haven't seen the word "woke" used much in this thread, and @Retro Doomer doesn't strike me as an overly political person.

But I think it is fair criticism to say a film feels too political, especially in an anachronistic way. This is something period dramas often suffer from, wanting a historical setting but refusing to compromise on contemporary ethics.

 

[Strategist Strategist]

I haven't seen the word "woke" used much in this thread, and @Retro Doomer doesn't strike me as an overly political person.

That's why I was surprised too, I've seen Retro Doomer post before and he didn't seem too rage baitey.

But I think it is fair criticism to say a film feels too political, especially in an anachronistic way. This is something period dramas often suffer from, wanting a historical setting but refusing to compromise on contemporary ethics.

Yes, it is definitively a retelling of Odyssey through a modern lens. I think that is something that people want from Nolan, though. He's a popular director and people want to see his take. There are plenty of other versions that are more faithful to the source material and its better to have many versions with different approaches.

I didn't see anything from the plot specifically as political. The casting could be seen as political if you think casting minorities and LGBTQ is inherently political. But I don't see it that way, that is simply a choice up to the casting director and all the people cast in this movie are professional hollywood actors, for whatever that is worth. I don't think the actors were placed in the best roles, but they are good actors in general.

 

[Retro Doomer]

I thought you were better than this, bud. You felt for the slop rage bait. It is definitively not a bad movie.

Its Blackwashing Helen of troy mate not sure what it is when not woke ?

But sure next time I want a movie about the Zulu where the cast the Zulu as white..since only the actors skill matter right ?

Also not everyone has to like the same Movie me not liking it is not ragebait.
I just don't like this historical revisionism.

Also I am not racist I don't care if a Actor is Black or White but it stands out strongly in a historically based Movie.
I also would critc if they made a Movie about Martin Luther king and made him white..hitorical figures should be respected and not be changed for "modern audiences"
Also this Movie is dissrespctul towards the Greeks I would say.

 

[Strategist Strategist]

Its Blackwashing Helen of troy mate not sure what it is when not woke ?

But sure next time I want a movie about the Zulu where the cast the Zulu as white..since only the actors skill matter right ?

Also not everyone has to like the same Movie me not liking it is not ragebait.
I just don't like this historical revisionism.

Also I am not racist I don't care if a Actor is Black or White but it stands out strongly in a historically based Movie.
I also would critc if they made a Movie about Martin Luther king and made him white..hitorical figures should be respected and not be changed for "modern audiences"
Also this Movie is dissrespctul towards the Greeks I would say.

Bro, Helen of Troy isn't a real person. The Odyssey is a myth from poem made up by Homer. Greek gods, Cyclops, Water Nymphs, Poseidon, Zeus, Athena, none of it is real. Did you think this was a historical tale? That's why I said you fell for the rage bait.

And furthermore, Nolan isn't trying to make a super accurate version of the Odyssey, it is clearly a modern retelling.

Plus I tell you, you guys only care about such things when it is white people. I've seen so many white Americans play latinos in movies with bad accents, I'm beyond taking offense. Like Al Pacino (italian American) playing a Puertorrican in Carlito's Way and a Cuban in Scarface.
These movies are relatively recent, by the way.

 

[Heidegger of Shinra]

He's a popular director and people want to see his take.

Perfectly valid, I personally haven't enjoyed his work since Memento. Even in the lauded Batman trilogy I really only liked the second film, and that was owing largely to Heath Ledger's performance.

I didn't see anything from the plot specifically as political.

They did decide to omit the mass execution of the handmaidens. Maybe hanging a dozen women at the conclusion of the story was seen as too dark, or maybe it was politically motivated. Whatever the case may be, it is worth considering. But not here, of course, we more than respect rule 4 in these parts!

 

[Retro Doomer]

Bro, Helen of Troy isn't a real person. The Odyssey is a myth from poem made up by Homer. Greek gods, Cyclops, Water Nymphs, Poseidon, Zeus, Athena, none of it is real. Did you think this was a historical tale? That's why I said you fell for the rage bait.

Its Greek Myth right European myths and guess what the Greeks are mate but sure next time take some African Myths and make them actors of African Gods white if this such a non issue.

Plus I tell you, you guys only care about such things when it is white people. I've seen so many white Americans play latinos in movies with bad accents, I'm beyond taking offense. Like Al Pacino (italian American) playing a Puertorrican in Carlito's Way and a Cuban in Scarface.
These movies are relatively recent, by the way.

Latinos are not a race you are aware of that right ? there a black and white Latinos and in between.
Latino is more Culturally and Linguistically not racial.

So your point is void in that regard.
And no like I said I would care both ways.

 

[WeAreAmalia]

I don't care if a Actor is Black or White

Love is blind, and so was Homer.

 

[Strategist Strategist]

Latinos are not a race you are aware of that right ? there a black and white Latinos and in between.
Latino is more Culturally and Linguistically not racial.

Do you take offense when Arnold Schwarzenegger plays an American rather unconvincingly in an action movie? Why draw the line at skin color and not accents? Should everyone who plays an American need to be born in America and speak perfect American English? We can go down this purist rabbit hole pretty deep if we get that nitpicky.

I don't really take offense to these race bending casting choices unless they are explicitly trying to make a historically accurate movie and are being extremely deliberate in their rewriting of history. Like that Cleopatra movie that said history was wrong and she was black, despite her clearly being 100% greek from historical records. The reality is that you are never going to get a big budget hollywood Odyssey with 100% greek actors.

 

[Heidegger of Shinra]

Do you take offense when Arnold Schwarzenegger plays an American rather unconvincingly in an action movie?

America is a multicultural society, why can't you be a huge Austrian man and be an American? Do you have something against huge Austrian men?

 

[Strategist Strategist]

America is a multicultural society, why can't you be a huge Austrian man and be an American? Do you have something against huge Austrian men?
View attachment 213273

you got me there. However he did play a cyborg despite being 100% flesh, bones and blood. That seems wrong to me.

 

[Retro Doomer]

Do you take offense when Arnold Schwarzenegger plays an American rather unconvincingly in an action movie? Why draw the line at skin color and not accents? Should everyone who plays an American need to be born in America and speak perfect American English? We can go down this purist rabbit hole pretty deep if we get that nitpicky.

I don't really take offense to these race bending casting choices unless they are explicitly trying to make a historically accurate movie and are being extremely deliberate in their rewriting of history. Like that Cleopatra movie that said history was wrong and she was black, despite her clearly being 100% greek from historical records.

Really ? really ?
that is your argument Arnold Schwarzenegger ?
you are aware Americans are not a ethnicity nor a race Americans come from many different people including Germans so no in such a situation it would be r word to take any offense to it.

Also in regard to English yes if you play a American you should speak perfect American English regardless of skin color or ethnicity otherwise its unbelievable.

I am more in terms of we should respect each others cultures and not claim them as our own. they are not respecting someone's culture when they take it and are molding it to something they like.

Love is blind, and so was Homer.
View attachment 213272

Beauty exists in every race but love goes trough the stomach in the end.
Not sure though what it has to do with Historical context since Troy is a place that is proven to have existed in the past.
So how she looks is best if we look up how people around Troy and Greece looked at that time to be historically accurate so that it feels natural and not forced.

 

[Heidegger of Shinra]

you got me there. However he did play a cyborg despite being 100% flesh, bones and blood. That seems wrong to me.

Rare to see anyone concede anything these days, even if it's only a minor point. I respect that.

And yes, Arnie was certainly appropriating the struggles of non-organic life with that one. I can't wait to see him trying to apologise to that community in 2058.

 

[Retro Doomer]

Rare to see anyone concede anything these days, even if it's only a minor point. I respect that.

And yes, Arnie was certainly appropriating the struggles of non-organic life with that one. I can't wait to see him trying to apologise to that community in 2058.
View attachment 213274

He gonna get cancelled for taking the jobs of hard working robots with his meatbag privilege.

 

[Strategist Strategist]

I am more in terms of we should respect each others cultures and not claim them as our own when they are not respecting someones culture does not mean taking it and molding it to something you like.

Beauty exists in every race but love goes trough the stomach in the end.
Not sure though what it has to do with Historical context since Troy is a place that is proven to have existed in the past.
So how she looks is best if we look up how people around Troy and Greece looked at that time to be historically accurate so that it feels natural and not forced.

I get your point but neither "woke" hollywood nor "based" old timey hollywood has ever cared for racial or cultural accuracy in movies. They just cast whomever they think is marketable or popular at the time. Its a losing battle to get upset about such things, but I get it, to a certain extent. Like the Al Pacino example I mentioned, I can see how it can be upsetting for one's race/culture to get mangled on film. But to renounce the enjoyment of cinema because of that seems too extreme to me. Like I can say Scarface is objectively a good film, despite Pacino's terrible Cuban accent.

 

[Dyne]

I thought this thread was going to turn bad but you guys are just over here being awesome despite disagreeing and I appreciate you