"Outdated" mechanics you defend

[CheelaCheela's icon]

Most of you only want seeing the world burn

Yes :3

I want passwords back /jk

 

[7eve70rd]

Games that benefit from modern emulation and "save scumming" usually include "outdated" mechanics that are frustrating.

Super Meat Boy did well to make difficult platforming rewarding, right?

Before that, on SNES, Donkey Kong 3 had sidescrolling levels with checkpoints half way thru.
Rare took the idea of the Bears from DK3 and started working on Banjo Kazooie. An adaption of a sidescroller into a 3D Mario64 clone platformer.


When the map opened up and was not an endurance run to cross a finish line the health system grew to be an annoyance.

We all know that the life system felt out of style after the 5th gen. While arcade-like experiences proves that they're still useful to this day, I'll make a case for games where they're less important. And for this example, I'll pick Banjo-Kazooie!

View attachment 65552​

This game have some challenges here and there, but it's more about progressing through exploration and completing all objectives. While the N64 version does harshly punish you for dying, having a life system is useless here because nothing actually changes when you Game Over, other than that you go through the inconvenience of being kicked to the title screen then the hub's staring area.

So what's the point? Well, it's...

SHAME!

View attachment 65551​

Admit it, you simply didn't wanted to get a game over as a kid. You just didn't. It was like the game getting mad at you.

In case of Banjo-Kazooie, it actually went greater and tragic lengths to prove this point, with its own elaborate bad ending when getting a Game Over.

Which would also play when just quitting to the title screen. I guess the developers expected you to beat the game in one sitting or something

Anyway, that's why I think a "unnecessary" life system is still cool to this day. Is there a game mechanic that became unpopular that you still defend?

Games that benefit from modern emulation and "save scumming" usually include "outdated" mechanics that are frustrating.

Super Meat Boy did well to make difficult platforming rewarding, right?

Before that, on SNES, Donkey Kong 3 had sidescrolling levels with checkpoints half way thru.
Rare took the idea of the Bears from DK3 and started working on Banjo Kazooie. An adaption of a sidescroller into a 3D Mario64 clone platformer.


When the map opened up and was not an endurance run to cross a finish line the health system grew to be an annoyance.


Would a better method of "game over screen" be the enemies capture you and kick you out of the level back to the overworld map?

 

[Waffles's iconWaffles]

Dialogue trees for me.

You learned so much about not only the character you were playing as, but about the game world at large based on stuff you COULD say.

 

[Graves Ruinwalker]

Tank-controls and its 3D-controls scheme after that which was implemented in RE1remake ObsCure and SH2 and in their sequels.

Tank controls aint bad if it was implemented with thought in design . Combat was more about positioning , timing and planing instead of aiming and reaction alone .

The 3D-control-scheme was awesome too and felt more like a evolution to Tank-controls and much more fluid control-scheme that made positioning and movement an important part while being more action-packed in a more grounded way . Combined with good and dynamic camera angles , you will never have any problem to navigate and play the game very efficiently with more buttons for mechanics and/or direct inputs .

 

[Viviana Santos]

Tank controls are cool actually, I love Tank Controls

 

[Moth_Lobster]

until mitsuru keeps casting Marin Karin even on bosses

But they do? The option is right there, nobody is forcing you to control them; and if you think the AI is bad, well it's always been bad with the infamous Mitsuru marin karin spam.

Everyone complaining about the Mitsuru Marin Karin spam tells on themselves because if you play the game properly (analyze enemy weaknesses and set your party's tactics) she won't be spamming marin karin on enemies it doesn't work on.

 

[Evaccaneer Doom]

know what you mean unlimited inventory is a nightmare to scroll through the whole inventory to find 1 key item or EQ

encumbrance is a good way to limit inventory in many games
another way is to have limited inventory slots

I never really found it a problem…if they coded in the thing where scrolling gets faster and faster similar to when you drag a file to the bottom and it goes ZOOM

 

[Moth_Lobster]

I think limited inventory space also has its use to keep the game balanced.
The older DQ games had an inventory limit, each character could only hold so many items, and this played a part because you couldn't just hoard healing items. There weren't many options for MP recovery in the early-game either, so you can't just spam healing spells. it was a really good way of keeping the player paced out, if you were running out of healing items and MP, it might be a good idea to head back to town, buy more items, rest up and try again. The fast travel spell wasn't useable inside dungeons and you usually unlocked it after you unlocked another spell that made you exit the dungeon, so you would need to manage your MP to make sure you keep enough on you to exit, and fast travel back if you were running low or if people were dying... or you could use a fast travel item, which once again doesn't work indoors, so now you needed to choose between saving an inventory spot for that wyvern wing, or using it for something else and saving the MP.

It was an entire core aspect of the game design down to the small details and giving the player the option to hoard items just kind of risks ruining this. The newer DQ games let you use the fast travel spell indoors, which already ruins that balance, but from 5 onwards they also had an unlimited inventory bag you can place items in, where I pretty much consistently had backup healing herbs or whatever in that I would use when not in battle. It just messes with the flow.
FFXV, a more modern game, also suffers from this because players can do sidequests and do other things to get extremely overpowered very easily and pretty much shows exactly why I have issues with this system. Money basically stops being a problem in the mid game if you play it right, which kind of ruins the traversal systems since they focus on money (refueling the car and renting chocobos). But also, you can just buy 99 of any item. anything. 99 phoenix downs. Why bother to learn the combat system when I can just use infinite healing items if I start to die? One of the postgame dungeons prevents players from using items and its noted as being one of, if not the hardest thing in the game specifically for that reason.

 

[RebelofDaNeonGod]

Tank controls, I will defend tank controls with my life. I can make the argument that it adds tension, it add difficulty, it add out of body playing, but the simple answer is that I like it therefore it should be in games, I am a selfish bastard

 

[rugal]

I never really found it a problem…if they coded in the thing where scrolling gets faster and faster similar to when you drag a file to the bottom and it goes ZOOM

i should have been more cleare
i refer to older games like ps1 ps2 original xbox or old pc games that do not have that function
and scrolling is slow
and you have over 500 items in inventory in that scenario its a nightmare to scrolling down

its not that mutch of a problem as you say if scrolling gets faster or if using a kontroll pad you can push a button to scroll to the bottom and push another button to scroll fast through inventory
on newer games its mostly not a problem

 

[Pokenami]

Having limited lives is something I liked in platformers mostly because it gives you a challenge and a small window to screw up.

 

[Ikagura]

Rare took the idea of the Bears from DK3 and started working on Banjo Kazooie. An adaption of a sidescroller into a 3D Mario64 clone platformer.

I always had that headcanon that the setting of B&K was in the same region as DKC 3.

 

[glokglakglak]

Turn based combat.

i fail to see how this is outdated seeing the number 1 game right now is literally turn-based

 

[Evaccaneer Doom]

i should have been more cleare
i refer to older games like ps1 ps2 original xbox or old pc games that do not have that function
and scrolling is slow
and you have over 500 items in inventory in that scenario its a nightmare to scrolling down

its not that mutch of a problem as you say if scrolling gets faster or if using a kontroll pad you can push a button to scroll to the bottom and push another button to scroll fast through inventory
on newer games its mostly not a problem

Oh ok then yeah I hate that too

 

[WesternYokai]

Many of them, actually. Of course accessibility is a nice thing to have, but I think that ultra-optimization in gameplay makes videogames more and more homogeneous and boring after all.

I like mechanics which you need to decide what path or item to choose and need an entire gameplay to do the opposite. Is it time consuming and sometimes I don't want to play the same game again? Yes, but this kind of thing makes games less a "product" and more a hobby where you don't finish like a deadline in a workplace. You just enjoy your time and that's it.

 

[Gafek Urslef]

I think split screen and couch co-op not being as common as it used to be is sad, I like playing online, but sharing beers with your buddies in person while playing multiplayer just hits different.

 

[7eve70rd]

i fail to see how this is outdated seeing the number 1 game right now is literally turn-based

Strategic turn based combat is how table top RPGs are played.

Dungeons and Dragons adapted for computer to act as dungeon master is a CRPG.

Turn Based RPGs have one argument: do we make the enemies invisible until they are randomly encountered?

And Random Encounter RPGs need game items/skills to reduce the frustration and the ability to escape to avoid total party knockout is part of the gameplay experience.

If the combat is real time (maybe with pause) then it's a ZERG rush like Starcraft and that's a different genre of game. Real Time Strategy games aren't very popular in 2025.

Turn Based RPGs can be made be a small dedicated team and the profit margins could be sustainable.

 

[Cantarella]

i fail to see how this is outdated seeing the number 1 game right now is literally turn-based

It's kind of viewed as such by CRETINS. Old and not appealing/flashy enough for modern audiences. You can see this kind of juvenile anxiety in Square-Enix.

"When asked to create Final Fantasy 16 by the higher-ups in the company, one of their orders was to fully maximize the use of the technology," says Yoshida-san. "And so when making that decision, we thought that the direction of taking [FF16] in that full action [route] was the way to do that. And when deciding whether, 'okay, are we going to go turn-based or are going to go action?' I made the decision to go action."

...

“As I said, I believe I know the fun of command system RPGs, and I want to continue developing them, but I thought about the expected sales of Final Fantasy XVI and the impact that we have to deliver."

 

[7eve70rd]

Older gamers have slower reaction speeds.

Fast button mashing does not appeal to many game buyers. Action doesn't mean so fast I can't discern what's going on. Max Payne bullet time!

Parents of children need to be able to "pause" and walk away from a game.

A million reasons why turn based, pause-able games, are desired.

LOADING screens are the mechanic that is outdated. I don't want to wait to play.

 

[Raziya The Seeker]

As others mentioned, I don't mind random encounters most of the time. They add a sense of danger to a dungeon, not knowing when you'll run into trouble. Besides, it's a good way to get resources and levels. They can get irritating at times, but not nearly enough where I'd disavow them, and games that use them, completely.

If done incorrectly, on-screen encounters can be kinda lame. Either you still can't evade them and it's annoying, or the monsters are just derping around and you're bullying them. Not really a threat, and can be just as big a nuisance as randoms (if not worse).

Besides, Pokemon fixed two issues with random encounters. One, areas where they can and can't appear outside of dungeons: tall grass and bodies of water. Two, the use of Repel makes avoiding them less finicky than how Dragon Quest did it beforehand. Three, the only non-grass overworld encounters you have to worry about are trainer battles, but those are more rewarding and can be avoided or prepared for. Being able to mitigate random encounters is always handy.

 

[Esidemoken]

I would say fixed cameras and tank controls but not because I think they are outdated but because of those who think it is impossible to play with them or that it is too difficult, i mean millions of players were able to finish games that used them without that much trouble in the past.

Whenever old mechanics are talked about as a bad thing I always ask, Which is more likely, that the old players were geniuses or that the current players don't have the ability and don't want to have it?

 

[edgeworX]

We must return to RPGs that don't force you to over the shoulder third person camera. BG3 uses a top view camera, but that's because it's partially a tactics game. I just... What have they done to Tales and Atelier?!

 

[moonbits]

I don't feel like a game mechanic becomes outdated but the way you interact with a game can be outdated because most of this posts are about interaction, like turn based, menus or cameras. Let this post be a gateway to opening the can of worms of "what is a game mechanic" "what's the difference between gameplay and game mechanic"

 

[Ain_Gamer]

An old mechanic?
Well area return. After cleaning whole area game make you revisit it to get new item or finish a quest.
This mechanic isn't much outdated but less use in this age.
It was annoying to reenter a swamp but how story goes and how we enf up there again.
I like it and also hate it. They should just make it more fair.

Isn't this just your average indie metroidvania ?

Post automatically merged: Tuesday at 12:40 AM

Limited save files. It feels like I need to think about the decisions I make in a game more if I can't just make a bunch of saves. A sweet spot for saves in my opinion is three.

I think Limited save file is more of thing because of technical limitations rather than deliberate design choice.

When this limitation was gone there was no reason to keep it, tho I generally don't care about it because I normally only use one save file anyway.

 

[CG4R12I4N]

Limited inventory and save files are good, but what's even better is enemies not dropping any currency in RPGs (at least for nonhumans) and thus the necessity to sell the loot yourself on the traders to actually getting the good items. That's the thing more games should have.