Hot takes

[Asian girls loverAsian girls lover's icon]

Xenoblade Chronicles 2 is a great games, despite what people here say. Who cares about the story and characters' develpment if the gameplay is fantastic?

 

[Jeanfranc]

Xenoblade Chronicles 2 is a great games, despite what people here say. Who cares about the story and characters' develpment if the gameplay is fantastic?

The infamous picture at the end of Xenoblade 3 is so great it makes it all worth it. Monolith I kneel

 

[Raccoonus]

If Dark Souls is a Third-Person Action RPG then how do we differentiate it from Onimusha? Or Dragon Age? Or Mass Effect? I get what you mean, the names are very cumbersome. But giving them a broad name is another can of worms. Keep in mind that "Hack and Slash" can refer to Diablo, Devil May Cry, and Dark Souls all at once, all very different games.

When someone says "Hack and Slash" I think of Bayonetta and Devil May Cry. If you tried playing a game with slow precise combat and RPG elements like Dark Souls as a Hack and Slash it just wouldn't work. I also just refer to a game like Diablo as an Isometric ARPG. I also think stuff like what you said regarding Onimusha, Mass Effect and Dragon Age are what sub-genre's are for. We can call Dark Souls both a third-person action RPG and strategy action game. Terms like this are obviously fluid I won't deny it, but I think it is much more productive to be as absolute and understanding to as many consumers as possible when defining a game into a genre categorically.

 

[Elwiwi]

Xenoblade Chronicles 2 is a great games, despite what people here say. Who cares about the story and characters' develpment if the gameplay is fantastic

The infamous picture at the end of Xenoblade 3 is so great it makes it all worth it. Monolith I kneel

Ah yes that picture ?? what a great self insert

Post automatically merged: Feb 17, 2025

Xenoblade Chronicles 2 is a great games, despite what people here say. Who cares about the story and characters' develpment if the gameplay is fantastic?

The only thing great about xeno2 is the dlc

 

[Jeanfranc]

Can't comment on Xenoblade 3 too much since I've played it on and off without finishing. Nobody's confirmed for me if it gets as cringe as XC2 does, so I'm reluctant to put the effort into powering through it.

Oh dear, you don't know then? the ending is so good it improves 2 retroactively.

Xenoblade 2 is my favorite, I really like the first one but it's mainly due to the glorious english dub. If I had played it in japanese I would've probably found it boring.

 

[RanmyakuIchi's iconRanmyakuIchi]

When someone says "Hack and Slash" I think of Bayonetta and Devil May Cry. If you tried playing a game with slow precise combat and RPG elements like Dark Souls as a Hack and Slash it just wouldn't work. I also just refer to a game like Diablo as an Isometric ARPG. I also think stuff like what you said regarding Onimusha, Mass Effect and Dragon Age are what sub-genre's are for. We can call Dark Souls both a third-person action RPG and strategy action game. Terms like this are obviously fluid I won't deny it, but I think it is much more productive to be as absolute and understanding to as many consumers as possible when defining a game into a genre

I consider Bayonetta and DMC as "Character Action" not Hack and Slash. I think Hack and Slash and think of Musou. I'm not saying you're wrong, just pointing out how terms like that have different interpretations from person to person.

 

[Jeanfranc]

Ah yes that picture ?? what a great self insert

Post automatically merged: Feb 17, 2025

Can't really self insert into that, I merely acknowledge my inferiority to a God like him, what an absolute mad lad

The only thing great about xeno2 is the dlc

I do like Torna but I prefer the main game, the mandatory community stuff is so bad.

Post automatically merged: Feb 17, 2025

the only good part of xenoblade 2 was pyra.

I disagree, all the girls where cute, It's actually hard to choose a favorite character: I'd say Zeke for the guys and either Pandoria or Poppi QTπ (mainly due to the design) for the girls

Earthbound/mother should stay dead

Indeed, Itoi ended the series instead of milking it with sequels, I respect that.

Btw, Mother 1 is my favorite

persona 3 portable should be eradicated from history

I was gonna say this, but for Reload instead of Portable lol. Persona 3 is pretty good, and when I play it, I always go for Portable, but the series peaked with Persona 2 in my opinion. And the third game is really held back by not having three flawed experiences with distinct highlights, and none being the definitive version.

The best version of persona 3 is FES, the remakes and ports are just not that great, and make the game even worse than it already is. Not to mention that FES already fucks up some stuff about the original like Chidori (if you know, you know), also, not an hot take but The Answer is so bad, It's unreal.

Honestly, the persona series indeed peaked with the first two entries. 3 is not very good nor are its sequels.

 

[Prism_Red]

Honestly, the persona series indeed peaked with the first two entries. 3 is not very good nor are its sequels.

Wait, are you real, I'm not alone? I'm not the only person who enjoy P1 and both P2 more than the sequels?
Where you been all this time brother.

 

[Elwiwi]

Can't really self insert into that, I merely acknowledge my inferiority to a God like him, what an absolute mad lad

I do like Torna but I prefer the main game, the mandatory community stuff is so bad.

Post automatically merged: Feb 17, 2025

I disagree, all the girls where cute, It's actually hard to choose a favorite character: I'd say Zeke for the guys and either Pandoria or Poppi QTπ (mainly due to the design) for the girls

Indeed, Itoi ended the series instead of milking it with sequels, I respect that.

Btw, Mother 1 is my favorite


The best version of persona 3 is FES, the remakes and ports are just not that great, and make the game even worse than it already is. Not to mention that FES already fucks up some stuff about the original like Chidori (if you know, you know), also, not an hot take but The Answer is so bad, It's unreal.

Honestly, the persona series indeed peaked with the first two entries. 3 is not very good nor are its sequels.

I don't know if you are being sarcastic or not ??

 

[Tonberry]

I've thought for a long time that terms like Metroidvania or Souls-like are worthless band-aid terms thought up by people who are bad at naming things and no one should use them. I mean what do you do about people that have never played Metroid, Castlevania or Dark Souls when you use terms like that? Why can't we say labyrinthine platformer or just call Dark Souls a third-person action RPG? I understand trying to make sense to someone who does know what those games are but these terms have no longevity is my point and they're being pushed as official terminology to sell products.

It might change in the future. Remember how every FPS after Doom were called Doom Clones for a while before they were called FPS? It’s nothing new.

”Metroidvanias” are non-linear platformers. ”Soulslikes” are action RPGs (which is a broad term already but that’s fine).

 

[Jeanfranc]

Wait, are you real, I'm not alone? I'm not the only person who enjoy P1 and both P2 more than the sequels?
Where you been all this time brother.

I don't know if you are being sarcastic or not ??

I'm not, I genuinely liked it

 

[fake-kun]

It might change in the future. Remember how every FPS after Doom were called Doom Clones for a while before they were called FPS? It’s nothing new.

”Metroidvanias” are non-linear platformers. ”Soulslikes” are action RPGs (which is a broad term already but that’s fine).

These names are extremely broad and non-specific to the point of being useless. For one thing, Mega Man games could easily be classified as non-linear platformers, since they let you beat the levels in any orders.

The genre names we have are fine the way they are.

 

[Jeanfranc]

These names are extremely broad and non-specific to the point of being useless. For one thing, Mega Man games could easily be classified as non-linear platformers, since they let you beat the levels in any orders.

The genre names we have are fine the way they are.

Indeed, genre names are quite vague. Imagine explaining what exactly makes a game an RPG.

 

[Tonberry]

These names are extremely broad and non-specific to the point of being useless. For one thing, Mega Man games could easily be classified as non-linear platformers, since they let you beat the levels in any orders.

They could, but they aren't. Megaman games still have you go through levels from A to Z in order to beat them, which makes them linear in another sense. Boomers refer to them as run-and-gun games but I've never liked that term personally, but it works, because it's the intricacies that help define the terms. The concepts evolve, which is why we aren't calling first-person shooters Doom Clones anymore. The terms are vague in and of themselves, but that doesn't mean that you can't have both looser and pinpoint-y descriptions at the same time. It's a pointless thing to argue about.

I'm copy-pasting this from that other thread as I was in the middle of typing it out:
Referring to certain subgenres after games is fine, but I prefer not to myself because I think it's reductive, because it sort of implies that you have to adhere to the rules the namesake games set, and if you deviate from them slighlty too much you're suddenly something else.

Genre-names are fluid and context dependent, and they constantly evolve. Genres exist as a means to easily identify similar qualities and aspects of a given thing. They're there to make it easier for you to find things you might like, based on things you do like.

In the end, the current genre-fighting in video games is more arguing semantics than anything. I don't think referring to games as other pre-existing games are good for the subgenres in the long run, because it more often than not feels like a derivative oversimplification that makes it harder to let games with unique aspects stand out, but I won't go around and wave my finger at someone who does or doesn't call Hollow Knight a "Metroidvania" but not a "Souls-like" even though it takes clear inspirations from both those kinds of games. It has more similarities to one of those types than the other, and at the end of the day it's a platformer.

The genre names we have are fine the way they are.

But "Metroidvania" or "Souls-like" aren't old terms. There's nothing wrong with continuing to evolve the definitions as more deviations occur.

We don't call rock music blues despite it being evolving forth from it, and we don't call The Lord of the Rings or Harry Potter the same sort of fantasy, even though they're both fantasy, and we don't refer to anime as cartoons, or cartoons as anime, even though they're very much the same thing when you boil it down; animation. Being specific is a good thing because it helps define works more clearly.

 

[fake-kun]

They could, but they aren't. Megaman games still have you go through levels from A to Z in order to beat them, which makes them linear in another sense. Boomers refer to them as run-and-gun games but I've never liked that term personally, but it works, because it's the intricacies that help define the terms. The concepts evolve, which is why we aren't calling first-person shooters Doom Clones anymore. The terms are vague in and of themselves, but that doesn't mean that you can't have both looser and pinpoint-y descriptions at the same time. It's a pointless thing to argue about.

I'm copy-pasting this from that other thread as I was in the middle of typing it out:
Referring to certain subgenres after games is fine, but I prefer not to myself because I think it's reductive, because it sort of implies that you have to adhere to the rules the namesake games set, and if you deviate from them slighlty too much you're suddenly something else.

Genre-names are fluid and context dependent, and they constantly evolve. Genres exist as a means to easily identify similar qualities and aspects of a given thing. They're there to make it easier for you to find things you might like, based on things you do like.

In the end, the current genre-fighting in video games is more arguing semantics than anything. I don't think referring to games as other pre-existing games are good for the subgenres in the long run, because it more often than not feels like a derivative oversimplification that makes it harder to let games with unique aspects stand out, but I won't go around and wave my finger at someone who does or doesn't call Hollow Knight a "Metroidvania" but not a "Souls-like" even though it takes clear inspirations from both those kinds of games. It has more similarities to one of those types than the other, and at the end of the day it's a platformer.


But "Metroidvania" or "Souls-like" aren't old terms. There's nothing wrong with continuing to evolve the definitions as more deviations occur.

We don't call rock music blues despite it being evolving forth from it, and we don't call The Lord of the Rings or Harry Potter the same sort of fantasy, even though they're both fantasy, and we don't refer to anime as cartoons, or cartoons as anime, even though they're very much the same thing when you boil it down; animation. Being specific is a good thing because it helps define works more clearly.

Pardon my French, but I don't think it matters at all. If the gaming collective decides Metroidvania is the most appropriate name for the subgenre, there's very little single persons like you or me can do. If/when that changes, so will the name.

 

[Tonberry]

Pardon my French, but I don't think it matters at all. If the gaming collective decides Metroidvania is the most appropriate name for the subgenre, there's very little single persons like you or me can do. If/when that changes, so will the name.

I mean, I agree with you. I just wanted to try and summarize and clarify my thoughts on the whole thing since you replied to my post.

Like I said, I don't really use the terms, but I recognize that they do their job well. Just like how I don't use the term run-n-gun which is ancient.

I think a reason why there's "pushback" for terms like that in the first place is because it kinda indirectly implies that the games they're named after are the pinnacle of the term (and even though I love Symphony of the Night, it's nowhere near as tight as Super Metroid, but that's besides the point lol, and no one can agree on what defines a "Souls" game somehow), which is part of a bigger problem in video games I think, where I feel there's a big sort of anti-intellectual "movement" who demands that video games must be taken seriously, but still refuses to let go of the old games, and elevate them based on subjective opinion rather than critical analysis, when those should be two different things.
But that's a discussion for another take. :)

 

[Egg (McMuffin) Man]

Doom isn't very fun

 

[MasterEn]

I mean, I agree with you. I just wanted to try and summarize and clarify my thoughts on the whole thing since you replied to my post.

Like I said, I don't really use the terms, but I recognize that they do their job well. Just like how I don't use the term run-n-gun which is ancient.

I think a reason why there's "pushback" for terms like that in the first place is because it kinda indirectly implies that the games they're named after are the pinnacle of the term (and even though I love Symphony of the Night, it's nowhere near as tight as Super Metroid, but that's besides the point lol, and no one can agree on what defines a "Souls" game somehow), which is part of a bigger problem in video games I think, where I feel there's a big sort of anti-intellectual "movement" who demands that video games must be taken seriously, but still refuses to let go of the old games, and elevate them based on subjective opinion rather than critical analysis, when those should be two different things.
But that's a discussion for another take. :)

i'd say a souls game would be akin to the old school nes games in a sense.
hard to learn, hard to master, but it is very satisfying when you do finally do get it. like clearing the old castlevania or ninja gaiden games without dying or getting hit. it can be done, but it takes a lot of time, patience, skill and the willpower to do so.
"souls" is just the newest name for "contra difficulty", more or less.

 

[Tonberry]

Doom isn't very fun

You mean Doom (2016), right?

 

[miguk]

Xenoblade Chronicles 2 is a great games, despite what people here say. Who cares about the story and characters' develpment if the gameplay is fantastic?

You know half the point of playing an RPG is the story, right? Even in the days of pen-and-paper D&D, that was a huge part of it. Remove all story elements from RPGs, and you might as well be doing math on a spreadsheet.

The gameplay ranged from okay at times to utterly frustrating. The tutorials don't explain much despite literally showing up until the last chapter. Their only value is in demonstrating what bad technical writing looks like. And then when you got the battle system down, it can get repetitive, as you find only a few chains that work well for everything. Then there's the town building, which is easily gamed and thus doesn't sustain for that long. Likewise, the skydiving minigame is frustrating garbage that you are forced to do to complete some tasks.

And the worst thing about the gameplay is the gatcha, which only gives you rare pulls early on, then spends the rest of the game giving you trash. Even early on, you risk getting trash rare pulls like Floren or Newt. (And so help you god if you pull Ursula, who is herself a whole gameplay quagmire.) And despite KOS-MOS being the main draw of the gatcha, there's a near-zero chance of ever getting her, as she's literally a 1/1,000,000 pull. Why would anyone want to do that gatcha nonsense over a million times when you'll win the game and new game+ long before you get her‽

And all this frustration comes side by side with the most unlikable cast of bigots, pedos, crypto-Nazis, misogynists, and enablers to ever grace a non-eroge RPG.

The infamous picture at the end of Xenoblade 3 is so great it makes it all worth it. Monolith I kneel

I looked it up and nearly threw up in my mouth.

Spoiler: spoilers for XC2 and XC3

I already knew from the ending of XC2 that Rex was implied to have gotten the harem ending he never deserved, but the end of XC3 outright says he got to bang 3 eternally young women he doesn't respect for the rest of his days. I'm not complaining about polygamy being in the story, but Rex of all people doesn't even earn one of those women. Not to mention Tora still doesn't have a restraining order on him, and apparently still has custody over his eternal child wife. And Azurda is still alive for some reason; how does this guy disobey a literal order from God to die for mankind's continued survival when none of the other titans were at all capable of doing so? That's damn inconsistent writing.

 

[MasterEn]

You know half the point of playing an RPG is the story, right? Even in the days of pen-and-paper D&D, that was a huge part of it. Remove all story elements from RPGs, and you might as well be doing math on a spreadsheet.

The gameplay ranged from okay at times to utterly frustrating. The tutorials don't explain much despite literally showing up until the last chapter. And then when you got the battle system down, it can get repetitive, as you find only a few chains that work well for everything. Then there's the town building, which is easily gamed and thus doesn't sustain for that long. Likewise, the skydiving minigame is frustrating garbage that you are forced to do to complete some tasks.

And the worst thing about the gameplay is the gatcha, which only gives you rare pulls early on, then spends the rest of the game giving you trash. Even early on, you risk getting trash rare pulls like Floren or Newt. And despite KOS-MOS being the main draw of the gatcha, there's a near-zero chance of ever getting her, as she's literally a 1/1,000,000 pull. Why would anyone want to do that gatcha nonsense over a million times when you'll win the game and new game+ long before you get her‽

And all this frustration comes side by side with the most unlikable cast of bigots, pedos, crypto-Nazis, and misogynists to ever grace a non-eroge RPG.


I looked it up and nearly threw up in my mouth.

Spoiler: spoilers for XC2 and XC3

I already knew from the ending of XC2 that Rex was implied to have gotten the harem ending he never deserved, but the end of XC3 outright says he got to bang 3 eternally young women for the rest of his days. I'm not complaining about polygamy being in the story, but Rex of all people doesn't even earn one of those women. Not to mention Torna still doesn't have a restraining order on him, and apparently still has custody over his eternal child wife. And Azurda is still alive for some reason; how does this guy disobey a literal order from God to die for mankind's continued survival? That's damn inconsistent writing.

i think these 2 might be trolling.

 

[fake-kun]

I mean, I agree with you. I just wanted to try and summarize and clarify my thoughts on the whole thing since you replied to my post.

Like I said, I don't really use the terms, but I recognize that they do their job well. Just like how I don't use the term run-n-gun which is ancient.

I think a reason why there's "pushback" for terms like that in the first place is because it kinda indirectly implies that the games they're named after are the pinnacle of the term (and even though I love Symphony of the Night, it's nowhere near as tight as Super Metroid, but that's besides the point lol, and no one can agree on what defines a "Souls" game somehow), which is part of a bigger problem in video games I think, where I feel there's a big sort of anti-intellectual "movement" who demands that video games must be taken seriously, but still refuses to let go of the old games, and elevate them based on subjective opinion rather than critical analysis, when those should be two different things.
But that's a discussion for another take. :)

That's just your interpretation. For example, nobody thinks Rogue is the pinnacle of rogue-likes, but it codified many gameplay elements associated with the genre, hence the name.

 

[Tonberry]

That's just your interpretation. For example, nobody thinks Rogue is the pinnacle of rogue-likes, but it codified many gameplay elements associated with the genre, hence the name.

Of course it's just my interpretation.
We both agreed that it doesn't matter in the long run, so everyone's interpretation should be valid. I think it's reductive but effective, others don't. That's totally fine.

 

[Asian girls loverAsian girls lover's icon]

You know half the point of playing an RPG is the story, right? Even in the days of pen-and-paper D&D, that was a huge part of it.

Not for me, I don't care about the story, I usually skip every dialogue and video. I just wanna play, not read. Otherwise I would take a book and read that on the couch.

D&D is another thing, in that case the story matter at full 100%, because basically you don't have nothing else.

 

[Pandaprewmaster325]

Doom isn't very fun

Goal: survive

And let this play in the background as you fight the doom fans