Hot takes

[KaiserMk7]

youtubers miss stuff because they are trying to be entertaining and focus on the game. something is going to slip by no matter how good they are.

sometimes puzzles are not very simple. i saw this in a rerez video about one of the tiny toons video games. the puzzle was obvious in hindsight, but it's hard because there isn't anything obvious or intuitive to lead you to the answer.

a lot of people do try to do the puzzle by themselves, but you do reach a point where you say "fuck it" and look to see if anyone else has done it.

There's a puzzle in the first professor layton game where the answer is a date and you must format it in a very specific way to get a pass rather than a failure.

 

[Dr.Kisaragi]

Well I am not a fan of Persona, Assassin Creed, The Last of Us, Nier (expect the ps3 one) Bayonetta, Xenoblade, and Shin Negami Tensei.

 

[vergil_heinlein]

Mega Man X6 is a good game.

 

[Pandaprewmaster325]

yes, i am right. i watched the game grumps. they missed some very obvious stuff while playing games.

Kind of why i hardly watch gameplay videos i would spend the video correcting the player lol

you'd think that, but they don't always do that. the puzzle i saw in that tiny toons game rewards you with a piece of paper to unlock a locker. the paper is inside of a film reel canister; which you open by going to the tennis court and using the can opener there to open the film reel canister. the hint is that you have a "can"ister and the tennis court has a "can" opener.

Yeah that sounds a little too specific with a strange hint.

no, not everyone is going to spend hours on a puzzle. a lot of people do not have patience.

Thats how separate real masters from casuals

 

[Ikagura Ikagura]

Thats how separate real masters from casuals

I know this is for the joke but I feel like many gamers have a false sense of honour when most people around that don't play game wouldn't care that much.

 

[ThatOneLum ThatOneLum]

Energy drink companies would go broke though

 

[Pandaprewmaster325]

I know this is for the joke but I feel like many gamers have a false sense of honour when most people around that don't play game wouldn't care that much.

I mean yeah only those who game would care?

 

[Ikagura Ikagura]

I mean yeah only those who game would care?

I won't insult anybody who has fun with video games because it's a hobby like music and movies.

On the other hand if someone, in society, is bragging about finishing Dark Souls in SL1 or any other "hard" tasks in video games, I am pretty sure many normal people (well, people not used to video games outside of the mainstream news or mobile ones) would see that person as a weirdly obsessed adult that doesn't always take a shower.

Somebody who won a sport competition or had helped science would be socially seen as a better person fundamentally speaking.

PS: It pains me to admit but people trying hard to make video games a "legitimate art form" (by making hours long analysis about Zelda or pseudo deep indie games) are making me loathe them more than people who just sees them as a hobby or entertainment.

 

[Kamako]

...people trying hard to make video games a "legitimate art form" (by making hours long analysis about Zelda or pseudo deep indie games) are making me loathe them more than people who just sees them as a hobby or entertainment.

I understand this take. But for me, the "are videogames art?" argument is solved pretty easily.

- Video games are comprised of various types of art created by artists.
- These works of art form a cohesive artistic work in the form of a playable game.

 

[Ikagura Ikagura]

I understand this take. But for me, the "are videogames art?" argument is solved pretty easily.

- Video games are comprised of various types of art created by artists.
- These works of art form a cohesive artistic work in the form of a playable game.

So you're saying it's an amalgamation?

I'd say that video game music and artworks can be art. Not the games per se.

Either way, many times I see people trying to convince that "video game is art" I mostly see either pseudo-intellectualism or desperation to make their hobby more legitimate.

Even people that love watching movies are trying hard to tell they're true appreciator by looking "artsy" movies while mocking people that liked the latest MCU.

 

[Kamako]

So you're saying it's an amalgamation?

Absolutely.

I'd say that video game music and artworks can be art. Not the games per se.

I can understand that.

Either way, many times I see people trying to convince that "video game is art" I mostly see either pseudo-intellectualism or desperation to make their hobby more legitimate.

Partly I chalk this up to passion, partly grifting through persuasion. If someone wants to make a living via YouTube, and all their content revolves around one topic, they're gonna try elevate that topic to make it seem like it's the most important thing in the world, and that their opinion on the subject is close to gospel.

Even people that love watching movies are trying hard to tell they're true appreciator by looking "artsy" movies while mocking people that liked the latest MCU.

All creative output is art imo. Any film, song, drawing, painting etc. None is greater or less than another. How the work impacts the beholder is totally subjective and dependent on artist intent, intended audience, the critic's mood for the day....It all seems very relative to me.

 

[Ikagura Ikagura]

Partly I chalk this up to passion, partly grifting through persuasion. If someone wants to make a living via YouTube, and all their content revolves around one topic, they're gonna try elevate that topic to make it seem like it's the most important thing in the world, and that their opinion on the subject is close to gospel.

I can understand someone wanting to have a deep analysis of something if there's clearly an underlying message beneath but trying to intellectualise everything would probably have a negative effect, portraying fans of the medium as obsessed people that try making the smallest molehill into the Everest. You're right about the gospel part.

All creative output is art imo. Any film, song, drawing, painting etc. None is greater or less than another. How the work impacts the beholder is totally subjective and dependent on artist intent, intended audience, the critic's mood for the day....It all seems very relative to me.

Intent is a major part of art yet I feel like some would create intent where there wasn't any because we cannot be sure what the author was thinking all the time (and honestly there's that interesting idea about the death of the author which is about not trying to find everything from their personal lives to justify their art).

Everything is relative after all.

 

[KaiserMk7]

I won't insult anybody who has fun with video games because it's a hobby like music and movies.

On the other hand if someone, in society, is bragging about finishing Dark Souls in SL1 or any other "hard" tasks in video games, I am pretty sure many normal people (well, people not used to video games outside of the mainstream news or mobile ones) would see that person as a weirdly obsessed adult that doesn't always take a shower.

Somebody who won a sport competition or had helped science would be socially seen as a better person fundamentally speaking.

PS: It pains me to admit but people trying hard to make video games a "legitimate art form" (by making hours long analysis about Zelda or pseudo deep indie games) are making me loathe them more than people who just sees them as a hobby or entertainment.

If films can be an art form, video games certainly can be too.

 

[ThatOneLum ThatOneLum]

I sometimes wonder if people confuse something "being art" and "having artistic merit"

Like, my little sister's doodles are really sweet and definitely art, but do they have artistic merit? No. They're for her to learn drawing and to show she's been thinking of me.

Similarly, technically Candice DeBeBe is a piece of art; but that doesn't mean it has artistic merit.

 

[moonbits]

It's a bit of a cop out to say because it's an amalgamation that it is art; by that perspective then mobile applications and websites are art because they take some artistic skill to realize.

I don't particularly find them to be art, since people are in control. Someone could play it like the developers intended and others might play it the way they want, skipping cutscenes or never touching the single player.

 

[semyaza]

applications, websites and even traffic signs can be art if people enjoy it as such, thats all there is to it imo, intent, craftmanship, usecase etc doesnt really matter

 

[shadowcat]

I would blame 90's localisation.

I don't think that's it. I've read enough manga and played enough JRPGs localized in that era to notice when they've taken liberties with localization or just done a poor job of it. Some conversations have too much of a 180 in tone to be blamed on that; it's more much similar to something like in a shounen manga when there is a super serious stare down with the enemy, and then somebody cuts the tension with a fart, except in Xenogear's case, the humor is not intended. The game just gives off YA novel writing that's trying to appear deeper than it is. Throwing in Jungian themes and then naming a character "Id" comes off closer to something akin to modern MCU, "look at this super cool reference, guys!", writing more than it does driving home the themes they are trying to present, especially with the lack of prowess and understanding on display when the themes of phycology, philosophy, and mythology are integrated into the narrative. I'll give Xenogears that it is ambitious, sure, and if your first exposure to these kind of themes was the game, maybe it could be the experience many describe, but I just didn't get that from it. I'm not trying to change anyone's opinion or sour anyone's feelings, just sharing my hot take, as per the thread title.

 

[moonbits]

Given the recent outrage on The Outer Worlds 2 not letting you romance your companions:

Romance in video games is super cringe, mediocre and the fact that people demand this feature is embarrassing.

Spoiler

Go on real dates, dating apps if you wanna romance someone.

 

[Leo-Dash]

You DON'T NEED to play a game yourself to experience and criticize the story aspects!

Just watch a full playthrough of it, you can judge the story aspect entirely by it, gameplay doesn't matter if the story is a movie!

 

[Pandaprewmaster325]

Given the recent outrage on The Outer Worlds 2 not letting you romance your companions:

Romance in video games is super cringe, mediocre and the fact that people demand this feature is embarrassing.

Spoiler

Go on real dates, dating apps if you wanna romance someone.

Careful right there you might get canceled for wanting connection with real human beings i mean how dare you call my virtual wife that i adore so much cringe? You know that I'm looking for you right now.....as i write this I'm contacting my agents through Europe , south America and north America to locate your exact location and address because no one and i mean NO ONE insults my virtual totally real and believable made out of pixels wife! I will have your head for this

 

[Ikagura Ikagura]

You DON'T NEED to play a game yourself to experience and criticize the story aspects! Just watch a full playthrough of it, you can judge the story aspect entirely by it, gameplay doesn't matter if the story is a movie!

I'd go the extra mile and saying that if you can experience most of the game through youtube then the gameplay isn't that interesting.

I'll always advocate for gameplay over story anytime (yes, even if MGS was revolutionary yet the gameplay still followed unlike Death Stranding).

 

[moonbits]

death stranding's gameplay is superb

 

[Xdqwerty Xdqwerty]

I've replayed the game not long ago and I don't recall having a surprise obstacle that I couldn't react to.

Thats called muscle memory.

 

[Trillid Tetraoxide]

Windows 10 and 11 is shit

 

[KaiserMk7]

Windows 10 and 11 is shit

Neither hot nor a gaming take.