What are your thoughts on TADC?

[TruthandConsequence]

You know, I know it's better for the forum as a whole to have people actually answer the questions properly, and ignore it if they aren't interested. But I miss the early days when certain people would just put outlandish shit on a question like this just to get a reaction.

Wait, how do I know that? I'm supposed to be new. Relatively.

Anyways, I haven't watched any of it yet, I kinda got turned off this type of thing when Vivziepop immediately shit on Helluva Boss with that second season. I really like the designs though, who's the guy in TADC that's just long and scrawny, like a pencil? I like that guy, he's got pizzazz.

 

[MajorMachina]

You know, I know it's better for the forum as a whole to have people actually answer the questions properly, and ignore it if they aren't interested. But I miss the early days when certain people would just put outlandish shit on a question like this just to get a reaction.

Wait, how do I know that? I'm supposed to be new. Relatively.

Anyways, I haven't watched any of it yet, I kinda got turned off this type of thing when Vivziepop immediately shit on Helluva Boss with that second season. I really like the designs though, who's the guy in TADC that's just long and scrawny, like a pencil? I like that guy, he's got pizzazz.

The rabbit or the chess one?

 

[dkpopman]

Perfectly fine children’s show

Glitch was cheated to serve the young adult demographic, TADC had a child audience by coincidence, but it is not made for children.

The only positives I can see out of this show are the gorgeous animation, the beautiful soundtrack, and the stunning voice acting. That's basically what held this show together, if we're completely being honest. Otherwise the writing is just simply BAD. I don't know why people glaze this show's writing to be honest.

So you like the majority of the creative decisions? Do you only critically value writing? I feel like you are not meeting the show where it's at, and are instwad comparing it to other things.

Never watched it, but feels like a big budget creepypasta.

There are no creepypasta elements. It's basically an isekai narrative and a homage to a Sci-Fi short story written in the late 60s with fun colors that focuses on identity and humanity.

 

[TruthandConsequence]

I've been meaning to say this for a long time now, but held off on saying because I was scared of potential backlash from the fandom, but I hate to break it to you all, but Gooseworx is not a good writer. She's the furthest thing from.
There is too much wasted potential in this show, character assassination galore, even those who are already flat characters to begin with, shoddy worldbuilding, more plot holes than an entire street road in Brazil, unanswered questions after unanswered questions, shallow messages at best and harmful and dangerous messages at worst, being told one thing in this show and then shown something completely different to contradict that claim (as in the constant failure to use "show, don't tell" efficiently), inconsistent continuity, janky dialogue that feels awkward at best and forced at worst, unnecessary conflict resolution, the noticable lack of nuance, and the fact that despite being advertised as a psychological horror show, it's clearly anything but. It feels more like a kids show with adult humor.
The only positives I can see out of this show are the gorgeous animation, the beautiful soundtrack, and the stunning voice acting. That's basically what held this show together, if we're completely being honest. Otherwise the writing is just simply BAD. I don't know why people glaze this show's writing to be honest.

Viviana, respectfully, sometimes you gotta say fuck it and slam your nether regions on the table and SAY YOUR SHIT! At least I enjoy your takes.

 

[MajorMachina]

So you like the majority of the creative decisions? Do you only critically value writing? I feel like you are not meeting the show where it's at, and are instwad comparing it to other things.

While i dont personally agree with their points, Writing is a pretty important thing in animations with stories. its reasonable to be critical of the overall thing if you didnt like the writing

 

[TruthandConsequence]

The rabbit or the chess one?

THERE'S TWO? I swear to god, if I say "the yellow one" and they're both yellow I quit lol.

This guy.

 

[MajorMachina]

THERE'S TWO? I swear to god, if I say "the yellow one" and they're both yellow I quit lol.

This guy.
View attachment 213420

thats Jax. Hes a character everyone in the fandom either despises or adores.

btw did you see Hazbin hotel? its made by the same creator as Helluva boss.

 

[Viviana Santos]

any particular examples of these flaws? not trying to start anything, im honestly curious

the problem with shows like TADC is that they're shows that built their stories upon mystery and intrigue, and invited their audience to engage with said mystery, to hypothesize, to notice every single detail.
you can't write a story like that and then just handwave all of that lore and make a half-assed finale that doesn't answer any of these questions.
it's one thing if these shows were sitcoms or romance or even action shows. there's usually not that much lore to be had there, unless you want to include some.

---

TADC starts off with a mystery surrounding the circus, its creators, the potential exit, etc. there were a bunch of stuff that initially seemed like clues, but now looking back, seems to be just random details added in for suspense.
if you're not ready to deliver on your promise of lore and worldbuilding, and instead suddenly make the decision to make your show "character focused" (which they didn't even do properly because the only character we focused on was the abusive purple bunny edgelord with le tragic muh sad backstory that feels like some lame pity party) that is ultimately a betrayal to your audience's expectations.
if you want to make a character-focused show, you should have done that from the beginning. you should have written a drama or a romance instead.
TADC is especially a disgrace as something that claims to be inspired by IHNMAIMS, when it doesn't even have a third of the worldbuilding and lore that the original SHORT STORY had!

 

[MajorMachina]

the problem with shows like TADC is that they're shows that built their stories upon mystery and intrigue, and invited their audience to engage with said mystery, to hypothesize, to notice every single detail.
you can't write a story like that and then just handwave all of that lore and make a half-assed finale that doesn't answer any of these questions.
it's one thing if these shows were sitcoms or romance or even action shows. there's usually not that much lore to be had there, unless you want to include some.

---

TADC starts off with a mystery surrounding the circus, its creators, the potential exit, etc. there were a bunch of stuff that initially seemed like clues, but now looking back, seems to be just random details added in for suspense.
if you're not ready to deliver on your promise of lore and worldbuilding, and instead suddenly make the decision to make your show "character focused" (which they didn't even do properly because the only character we focused on was the abusive edgelord with a tragic backstory) that is ultimately a betrayal to your audience's expectations.
if you want to make a character-focused show, you should have done that from the beginning. you should have written a drama or a romance instead.

Gooseworx made it clear from the very beginning that the story was gonna be character focused. i dont believe she suddenly changed it halfway through.
Though i will agree that the show did leave too many things up in the air lore-wise.

TADC is especially a disgrace as something that claims to be inspired by IHNMAIMS, when it doesn't even have a third of the worldbuilding and lore that the original SHORT STORY had!

the original short story didnt have that much lore and world building aside from the origins of AM and it too was focused most on the characters. It was the PC game that expanded the lore and world building.

 

[TruthandConsequence]

thats Jax. Hes a character everyone in the fandom either despises or adores.
View attachment 213421
btw did you see Hazbin hotel? its made by the same creator as Helluva boss.

I didn't like the set of characters in Hazbin the way I did with Helluva, idk they just didn't mesh well. But, I'm also not the target audience for that stuff. Which is funny considering Invader Zim is one of my favorites. Idk what it is about it. I know with Helluva it was how they immediately fell into either excessive swearing, or disney musicals. There was also that one plot point that was handled so terribly, don't really wanna mention it. Maybe I'll give Hazbin a second try.

 

[MajorMachina]

I didn't like the set of characters in Hazbin the way I did with Helluva, idk they just didn't mesh well. But, I'm also not the target audience for that stuff. Which is funny considering Invader Zim is one of my favorites. Idk what it is about it. I know with Helluva it was how they immediately fell into either excessive swearing, or disney musicals. There was also that one plot point that was handled so terribly, don't really wanna mention it. Maybe I'll give Hazbin a second try.

i personally liked hazbins season 2 more than helluvas. it had a lot more tension whereas Helluva boss really struggled to balance its comedy and drama.

the pacing and low episode count is hazbins biggest issues for me though.

 

[Viviana Santos]

Gooseworx made it clear from the very beginning that the story was gonna be character focused. i dont believe she suddenly changed it halfway through.
Though i will agree that the show did leave too many things up in the air lore-wise.

So she did a really poor job with it, because the first episode and episodes like episode 7 gave me the feeling that this was going to be a Gravity Falls-style show

Post automatically merged: Yesterday at 8:06 PM

Honestly I'm starting to realize that my issue with TADC is less the show itself but rather the fandom acting like it's some modern masterpiece by the ranks of Shakespeare and you need an IQ of over 300 to understand it when in my humble opinion it's a very mediocre show with cool concepts but way too much wasted potential in both its lore and characters (except Jax, because TADC becomes the Jax Show during its latter half)

---

Not all fans are like this but there are enough fans that will tell you to kill yourself for having the slightest issues with show for me to start having a problem with it.

 

[dkpopman]

So she did a really poor job with it, because the first episode and episodes like episode 7 gave me the feeling that this was going to be a Gravity Falls-style show

I think this is more of a "I don't like her writing" than a "her writing is objectively bad" situation.

Also I Have No Mouth has barely any worldbuilding, it's a tiny story. I think that claim you made about it having more worldbuilding is a bit ridiculous.

Also, as far as I see things, obsessing over worldbuilding as opposed to the characters and their story is really inhuman to me. How is that not your main interest? I feel the same way listening to a lot of conversations about Evangelion.

 

[TruthandConsequence]

So she did a really poor job with it, because the first episode and episodes like episode 7 gave me the feeling that this was going to be a Gravity Falls-style show

Post automatically merged: Yesterday at 8:06 PM

Honestly I'm starting to realize that my issue with TADC is less the show itself but rather the fandom acting like it's some modern masterpiece by the ranks of Shakespeare and you need an IQ of over 300 to understand it when in my humble opinion it's a very mediocre show with cool concepts but way too much wasted potential in both its lore and characters (except Jax, because TADC becomes the Jax Show during its latter half)

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Not all fans are like this but there are enough fans that will tell you to kill yourself for having the slightest issues with show for me to start having a problem with it.

Right on the table. That's what we like to see.

I get this though. It's a big thing with interests and fandoms in general these days, where if you don't follow suit and have the same exact opinion you are getting crucified, no room for other opinions.

 

[MajorMachina]

Honestly I'm starting to realize that my issue with TADC is less the show itself but rather the fandom acting like it's some modern masterpiece by the ranks of Shakespeare and you need an IQ of over 300 to understand it when in my humble opinion it's a very mediocre show with cool concepts but way too much wasted potential in both its lore and characters (except Jax, because TADC becomes the Jax Show during its latter half)

Hype's a bitch sometimes. everything has to be the either the worst or best thing ever. its always best to go into something blind and come to your own conclusions.

 

[dkpopman]

Honestly I'm starting to realize that my issue with TADC is less the show itself but rather the fandom

I strive to never consider the fan base of anything when I'm critically assessing something. Otherwise, a lot of good things I enjoy would get sullied for me, or I would never get into someting good if I did.

I get what you mean though about the TADC fanbase. I think the reason it moves the way it does is because of the massive size of the fanbase, and the fact that it's main demographic is people who are 15-23 years old, which are often going to be people with very strong opinions based off very little experience. (not hating, the kids are alright etc etc)

 

[Viviana Santos]

Also, as far as I see things, obsessing over worldbuilding as opposed to the characters and their story is really inhuman to me. How is that not your main interest? I feel the same way listening to a lot of conversations about Evangelion.

I like character-driven stories as much as anyone else; one of my favorite shows is Moral Orel, and that one is (especially in its second and third seasons) incredibly character-driven. The problem I have with TADC is that, aside from Jax, none of the characters are well-developed or deep (and Jax isn’t even a deep character, he’s just the only one the show bothers to explore more deeply in terms of his backstory). It doesn’t help that I’ve seen people online trying to convince me that this show is “deep” when its writing is incredibly shallow and immature.

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TADC wishes it had a scene as raw and human as this one

 

[TruthandConsequence]

I like character-driven stories as much as anyone else; one of my favorite shows is Moral Orel, and that one is (especially in its second and third seasons) incredibly character-driven. The problem I have with TADC is that, aside from Jax, none of the characters are well-developed or deep (and Jax isn’t even a deep character, he’s just the only one the show bothers to explore more deeply in terms of his backstory). It doesn’t help that I’ve seen people online trying to convince me that this show is “deep” when its writing is incredibly shallow and immature.

---

TADC wishes it had a scene as raw and human as this one

Should've hit him with the Nurse talking to her bears lol.

Post automatically merged: Yesterday at 8:36 PM

I strive to never consider the fan base of anything when I'm critically assessing something. Otherwise, a lot of good things I enjoy would get sullied for me, or I would never get into someting good if I did.

I get what you mean though about the TADC fanbase. I think the reason it moves the way it does is because of the massive size of the fanbase, and the fact that it's main demographic is people who are 15-23 years old, which are often going to be people with very strong opinions based off very little experience. (not hating, the kids are alright etc etc)

Yeah, you can't take fandoms into consideration on stuff. You won't end up enjoying anything lol.

Here's a secret. I love Undertale, and Homestuck. You think I tell anyone ONLINE that? Well, I just did, now I'm cursed lol.

 

[Viviana Santos]

Should've hit him with the Nurse talking to her bears lol.

Oh yeah, I forgot about that scene. I still think it's kind of crazy how Moral Orel still has the best and most realistic portrayal of the lasting consequences and emotional scars that sexual assault/abuse leaves on its victims (especially women).

It's so unfair that they canceled this show, ignorant people are fine when they make jokes or romanticize the abuse, but when you talk about the abuse in a serious and very respectful way, ignorant people will say "you crossed the line"

 

[TruthandConsequence]

Oh yeah, I forgot about that scene. I still think it's kind of crazy how Moral Orel still has the best and most realistic portrayal of the lasting consequences and emotional scars that sexual assault/abuse leaves on its victims (especially women).

It's so unfair that they canceled this show, ignorant people are fine when they make jokes or romanticize the abuse, but when you talk about the abuse in a serious and very respectful way, ignorant people will say "you crossed the line"

I watched this at the ripe age of eight. Really awesome to be exposed to.

But, yeah, I know how you feel. It's such a powerful scene.

Edit. I had to walk away mid thought. No, it frustrates me the way abuse in general gets treated. People don't get the help they need because they get shamed or ignored. I've went through it, a close friend went through it, a close family member went through it. Breaks my heart.

 

[MajorMachina]

I like character-driven stories as much as anyone else; one of my favorite shows is Moral Orel, and that one is (especially in its second and third seasons) incredibly character-driven. The problem I have with TADC is that, aside from Jax, none of the characters are well-developed or deep (and Jax isn’t even a deep character, he’s just the only one the show bothers to explore more deeply in terms of his backstory). It doesn’t help that I’ve seen people online trying to convince me that this show is “deep” when its writing is incredibly shallow and immature.

While i wouldn't call the characters "deep", i did find them interesting and enjoyable. i guess its just another example of people trying to elevate something into a masterpiece when it can just be good

 

[TruthandConsequence]

While i wouldn't call the characters "deep", i did find them interesting and enjoyable. i guess its just another example of people trying to elevate something into a masterpiece when it can just be good

I know I've just been butting my head in with bullshit. But honestly I agree with all your guys angles. On one hand I feel someone is entitled to critically analyzing things. But I also feel like some things are better enjoyed when you don't take them so seriously. Honestly, I haven't watched the show as mentioned. But that seems to be the vibe I get from it, you shouldn't take it seriously.

Viviana spittin too though.

 

[dkpopman]

The problem I have with TADC is that, aside from Jax, none of the characters are well-developed or deep (and Jax isn’t even a deep character, he’s just the only one the show bothers to explore more deeply in terms of his backstory)

I know this won't magically make the characters work for you, but this is actually addressed in episode 6. The characters in the Circus slowly lose their deeper identities and largely become archetypes as a way to cope with what they're trapped in.

Is this a clever idea, or is it a concession to make up for a show that was written to only be about ~5 hours long? Who knows.

 

[Viviana Santos]

I know this won't magically make the characters work for you, but this is actually addressed in episode 6. The characters in the Circus slowly lose their deeper identities and largely become archetypes as a way to cope with what they're trapped in.

Is this a clever idea, or is it a concession to make up for a show that was written to only be about ~5 hours long? Who knows.

I think it's a concession to make up for a show that should had more episodes, but fair enough

 

[zerodayhx]

I know this won't magically make the characters work for you, but this is actually addressed in episode 6. The characters in the Circus slowly lose their deeper identities and largely become archetypes as a way to cope with what they're trapped in.

Is this a clever idea, or is it a concession to make up for a show that was written to only be about ~5 hours long? Who knows.

also gooseworx has said many times the only main characters are pomni and jax, so like yea the others arnt going to be as fleshed out