Modern Games Pet Peeves

[Lee__Kanker]

You could have an entire debate on that particular battle system. "Free flow combat"

I've only liked it in batman, it's so limiting anywhere else, cause they just copy asylum it because it's an easy way to make something that's good enough for the average player. There's no ways to be creative or have your own playstyle
I dont know if assassins' creed counts as free flow, but MAN the ones I played (1 2 brotherhood) had awful combat, 1 was just "wait and press a button", 2 and B were "do that but also spam the one attack button"

And with batman it's very quick, it fits him, 2 made lots of improvements like focus hits, gadgets, multiple enemies attacking depending on difficulty, disabling any markers on hard mode, the huge enemy count, the fact it was mixed with stealth sections...

 

[Ravl]

Pretty much post 2007 every youtuber or anglo internetian agreed "ps1 was never good what were they thinking"

Never heard that about the ps1. I always thought it was NES that was hated by pseuds on Youtube.

in italy it stayed very popular

Is there any resemblance of a retrogaming comunity there? I happen to know the language so it might be interesting to check that out

 

[Lee__Kanker]

Never heard that about the ps1. I always thought it was NES that was hated by pseuds on Youtube.

Is there any resemblance of a retrogaming comunity there? I happen to know the language so it might be interesting to check that out

No that was better than jesus and mario 3 was the best game ever made along with ocarina of time

How in blazes do you know italian?
There certainly is but I dont know anyone, I can tell you MAME and the sega model 3 emulators are italian

I swear people like Kojima should just go to Hollywood and never come back

Hey Kojima is a movie nerd but his games are nothing like today's big budet stuff (granted I havent played mgs5 and death stranding); mgs 1 2 3 4 are all very mechanically complex, require a lot of strategy and figuring stuff out for yourself and any cutscene is skippable, it's nothing like the last of us

 

[Ravl]

How in blazes do you know italian?

Ho vissuto qualche anno in Italia per motivi di studio. Fra i vari amici che mi sono fatto là non ho mai incontrato uno a cui piacessero i videogiochi retro, era già difficile trovare qualcuno a cui non piacessero solo GTA, CoD e giochi EA Sports

There certainly is but I dont know anyone, I can tell you MAME and the sega model 3 emulators are italian

That much I knew, it's as if these people they were hiding or something

Hey Kojima is a movie nerd but his games are nothing like today's big budet stuff (granted I havent played mgs5 and death stranding); mgs 1 2 3 4 are all very mechanically complex, require a lot of strategy and figuring stuff out for yourself and any cutscene is skippable, it's nothing like the last of us

Perhaps I was too hard on the guy, I just do not like his games after MGS3, expecially Death Stranding (also MGS4 being 50% cutscenes). As you said we mostly have Naughty Dog to blame for all "movie games" we see these days.

 

[Lee__Kanker]

Ho vissuto qualche anno in Italia per motivi di studio. Fra i vari amici che mi sono fatto là non ho mai incontrato uno a cui piacessero i videogiochi retro, era già difficile trovare qualcuno a cui non piacessero solo GTA, CoD e giochi EA Sports

That much I knew, it's as if these people they were hiding or something

Perhaps I was too hard on the guy, I just do not like his games after MGS3, expecially Death Stranding (also MGS4 being 50% cutscenes). As you said we mostly have Naughty Dog to blame for all "movie games" we see these days.

Esatto, sono quasi tutti così. The ppl who are into arcade games or make emulators and restore cabinets are 40-50 :P
I take you're west european?

Yes 4 has a lot of em but they're all skippable and the game is as mechanically complex as ever, theres nothing close to the stuff I complained about

Yes it's all naughty dog's fault, not literally of course, but I describe every modern big budget game as a "the last of us clone"
I love this video

 

[tselinoyarsk]

In no particular order:

• Art direction
• Story/narrative direction
• Skin gambling
• Pay to win
• The obvious interact button prompts
• Yellow paint markers, paint arrows, directional arrows, mission markers, etc.
• Excessive amounts of DLC (usually it's content that should have already been in or is already in the game)
• Generally anything with in-game payments and/or a storefront in-game.
• Crafting (doesn't need to be in every game)
• Open-world (few games need to be open-world, structured level design would be better)
• Lack of unique mechanics
• A game being placed in the stealth genre, when there is literally only one or two stealth mechanics in-game
• Asset flips (typically from Unity or Unreal)
• Games with puzzle's being laughably easy

Some of this has already been mentioned already, but these are my pet peeves.

 

[Ravl]

I take you're west european?

Heh, Perhaps

Yes it's all naughty dog's fault, not literally of course, but I describe every modern big budget game as a "the last of us clone"
I love this video

Yeah, Bunnyhop is great and actually manages to make a point without making a 30+ minutes essay like most

 

[Lee__Kanker]

In no particular order:

• Art direction
• Story/narrative direction
• Skin gambling
• Pay to win
• The obvious interact button prompts
• Yellow paint markers, paint arrows, directional arrows, mission markers, etc.
• Excessive amounts of DLC (usually it's content that should have already been in or is already in the game)
• Generally anything with in-game payments and/or a storefront in-game.
• Crafting (doesn't need to be in every game)
• Open-world (few games need to be open-world, structured level design would be better)
• Lack of unique mechanics
• A game being placed in the stealth genre, when there is literally only one or two stealth mechanics in-game
• Asset flips (typically from Unity or Unreal)
• Games with puzzle's being laughably easy

Some of this has already been mentioned already, but these are my pet peeves.

I didnt mention microtransactions and shitty dlc because saying they're bad is like saying the sky is blue
I was weirded out when I saw Nier Automata classified as open world because I associate the genre with bland maps and samey quests

Everything using the same engines is contributing to all games feeling and controlling the same

An actual puzzle in mainstream games is so rare, again because they're terrified at the thought of you getting stuck and not playing it to the end and buying the season pass

Another one is the protagonist commening on everything that happens instead of you filling in with your own thoughts; like I can tell you "When I saw the licker in resident evil 2 I went "HUH??" instead I played the remake at a friends house and leon says himself "what was that"; ruining the surprise too cause in 2 you can miss it or only see it with the corner of your eye as it is silent

 

[moonbits]

They either copy God of War 2018 combat or Dark Souls combat.

What a wonderful time to be an action gamer.

*punches the wall and screams*

 

[Lee__Kanker]

They either copy God of War 2018 combat or Dark Souls combat.

What a wonderful time to be an action gamer.

*punches the wall and screams*

Of fucking course the silent hill 2 remake has a souls-like combat, thats what I want in a horror game
If I see that dodge one more time I'm gonna become the Joker

I also hate it how journalists seem allergic to any camera system that's not like tlou\souls, they always call it an "Improvement"; what happened to creative camera angles? Cinematography? Memorable shots? The whole thing with horror games used to be the camera is set so you dont clearly see where monsters are and you gotta use your ears

 

[It's Thinking 2]

Of fucking course the silent hill 2 remake has a souls-like combat, thats what I want in a horror game
If I see that dodge one more time I'm gonna become the Joker

I also hate it how journalists seem allergic to any camera system that's not like tlou\souls, they always call it an "Improvement"; what happened to creative camera angles? Cinematography? Memorable shots? The whole thing with horror games used to be the camera is set so you dont clearly see where monsters are and you gotta use your ears

Which is why it's so dark. I do miss the old camera angles of horror games on the PS1 and PS2. Even non horror titles like that scene in FFVII where Sephiroth is in the basement of the Shinra Manor.

 

[Lee__Kanker]

Which is why it's so dark. I do miss the old camera angles of horror games on the PS1 and PS2. Even non horror titles like that scene in FFVII where Sephiroth is in the basement of the Shinra Manor.

It's so damn cool how the camera at the beginning of silent hill 2 is set so it looks like something is watching you from behind the trees, even knowing theres nothing its so damn eerie; mixed with all the sound effects
1 has so many amazing angles, THE LIGHTHOUSE SPIRAL STARCASE MAN ITS SO COOL
The beginning in the alley, the school exit when you leave, it made me go "Games can do that??"

Outside of horror, games used to have CINEMATOGRAPHY, a specific style; now everything looks like a netflix show with the face zooming
Devil May Cry 1&3 are such joy to explore, aside from the enviroments the camera angles make em so memorable, they're carefully made so everything looks like a cool diorama\set, Haunting Ground too gosh the castle is so beautiful

I've also seen game jurnos compare stuff like sekiro and stellar balde saying their combat is like devil may cry; give me a break, there's nothing close to jump cancelling or royalguard or all the different knockback values for each attack you gotta learn for dante must die. They just look at any combo longer than 3 hits and go "dmc!"; even dmc1 with his simple combos has a lot of enemy variety and beheaviour. Each enemy has so many moves depending on your positioning and they have critical hits, you gotta learn the scoring system and game economy..

 

[Waffles's iconWaffles]

Mine is the oversimplification of the maps.

I get why this is done, but it feels silly playing through a level on a modern game where there is a single path to follow when something from 25 years ago would have taken the same exact map and fill it with shortcuts, alternative routes, secret passages and secondary roads for you to find. Some might even reaward your creativity by leaving a good reward for your outside-the-box thinking.

 

[Kacho]

I really don't like how a lot of quirky games always have to be so self-aware in its writing. In a lot of modern writing for games, if something is a bit odd or weird, you will often have characters in the game point out that it is weird. It breaks my immersion and it gets even worse when the joke often just falls back on breaking the fourth wall.
A good example of letting something weird just be weird is Earthbound (might be an unfair comparison since the head writer is an published and experienced author but it gets my point across). There is so much about that world that is so weird to us but most NPC won't comment or say much about it because it is something that has always been there and is commonplace for them in that world. I often feel like video game writing has become very hamfisted in its writing to make sure that no one misses the writers witty remark or funny joke. As much as I enjoy Undertale I do think it got a lot worse after the popularity of that game due to a lot of developers trying to emulate the kind of comedy that Undertale was going for, when it would probably help them to look for what inspired Undertales writing.

 

[It's Thinking 2]

I really don't like how a lot of quirky games always have to be so self-aware in its writing. In a lot of modern writing for games, if something is a bit odd or weird, you will often have characters in the game point out that it is weird. It breaks my immersion and it gets even worse when the joke often just falls back on breaking the fourth wall.
A good example of letting something weird just be weird is Earthbound (might be an unfair comparison since the head writer is an published and experienced author but it gets my point across). There is so much about that world that is so weird to us but most NPC won't comment or say much about it because it is something that has always been there and is commonplace for them in that world. I often feel like video game writing has become very hamfisted in its writing to make sure that no one misses the writers witty remark or funny joke. As much as I enjoy Undertale I do think it got a lot worse after the popularity of that game due to a lot of developers trying to emulate the kind of comedy that Undertale was going for, when it would probably help them to look for what inspired Undertales writing.

It's awkward hipster humor. Ever see that South Park episode? "AWKWARD!"

 

[Lee__Kanker]

I really don't like how a lot of quirky games always have to be so self-aware in its writing. In a lot of modern writing for games, if something is a bit odd or weird, you will often have characters in the game point out that it is weird. It breaks my immersion and it gets even worse when the joke often just falls back on breaking the fourth wall.
A good example of letting something weird just be weird is Earthbound (might be an unfair comparison since the head writer is an published and experienced author but it gets my point across). There is so much about that world that is so weird to us but most NPC won't comment or say much about it because it is something that has always been there and is commonplace for them in that world. I often feel like video game writing has become very hamfisted in its writing to make sure that no one misses the writers witty remark or funny joke. As much as I enjoy Undertale I do think it got a lot worse after the popularity of that game due to a lot of developers trying to emulate the kind of comedy that Undertale was going for, when it would probably help them to look for what inspired Undertales writing.

It's not just games, everything has to be s u b v e r s i v e and m e t a while being genuine is CRIIIIIINGE

Face it indie devs: you're never gonna be as good as Mother or the new Undertale; when the subversion is predictable it becomes the new clichè
Only, an old fashioned story doesnt have to be original to be good, a "so meta!!" stuff tends to have nothing going for it aside from the twist. YIIK is the most infamous example


The ps1 had more than just horror indie devs, could you PLEASE do more genres? Cmon! Make more stuff like this

 

[moonbits]

It's not just games, everything has to be s u b v e r s i v e and m e t a while being genuine is CRIIIIIINGE

Face it indie devs: you're never gonna be as good as Mother or the new Undertale; when the subversion is predictable it becomes the new clichè
Only, an old fashioned story doesnt have to be original to be good, a "so meta!!" stuff tends to have nothing going for it aside from the twist. YIIK is the most infamous example


The ps1 had more than just horror indie devs, could you PLEASE do more genres? Cmon! Make more stuff like this
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that's a rather aggressive generalization, browse around Steam there's plenty of unique indie games.

 

[It's Thinking 2]

that's a rather aggressive generalization, browse around Steam there's plenty of unique indie games.

Yeah but the PS-One horror thing is spot on. lol Itch.io is loaded with them.

 

[Lee__Kanker]

that's a rather aggressive generalization, browse around Steam there's plenty of unique indie games.

This is a pet peeves thread, theres exceptions to everything Ive posted, when I say all big budget games are the same I dont mean it literally

 

[dropsmegamega]

But in terms of actual gameplay, I'm gonna say that maybe "crafting" is becoming too prevalent in modern games.
I mean if you enjoy crafting that's cool, there are plenty of games for you to play where that's a thing, and I'm glad you're having fun.
But the problem is that's it's a game mechanic that is seeping into too many games where it just doesn't belong.
Like it's basically the norm now, whether you like it or not.

I know that's a bit of a spicy take, but I'm happy for people to disagree! ?

I really hate how every RPG nowadays needs to have crafting, RPGs are already long enough without all these extra mechanics that want you to waste hours looking at your inventory. Besides is terrible world building when our adventurer who spends most of his time fighting and exploring is somehow a better crafter than any weaponsmith in the game.

 

[Lee__Kanker]

I really hate how every RPG nowadays needs to have crafting, RPGs are already long enough without all these extra mechanics that want you to waste hours looking at your inventory. Besides is terrible world building when our adventurer who spends most of his time fighting and exploring is somehow a better crafter than any weaponsmith in the game.

In general every game needs to be bloated and 60 milion hours to justify the fact they spent 80 milion dollars on it; so they give em filler like copy paste quests and shallow busywork. Just look at silent hill 2 remake, the original game you can finish in a weekend but now that it's big budget and next gen it needs to be three times the lenght (while still having only 3 enemies for the most part). So

I blame angry joe

 

[dropsmegamega]

This one is the absolute worst. If your game is all about "exploration" there should be no wayponts or objective markers. This applies to most games actually, like when in a modern jprg you need to "investigate the area/talk to people in town" and the game points you to exact guy you need to speak to proceed with the story.
Rpgs, and expecially Jrpgs, got so much worse in the past 20 years It's unreal.

Handholding is required for modern adiences. If a game these days even remotely requires the player to use his brain, using basic reading comprehension skills for navigation or puzzles, people would be schreetching at the devs with pitchforks.
While challenging games still exist, in the AAA sphere It's all about them movie games. I swear people like Kojima should just go to Hollywood and never come back

I agree, but I feel its not just because "dumb modern audiences", often is just a way to mask poor design like having to talk to a specific RANDOM npc to progress story or having super detailed environments filled with computers and other objects, but only one of then can actually be interacted with. Like, if you actually removed the quest compass from one of these modern games, there would be no way to know where to go because the developers are too lazy to have the npcs actually give you directions and have no idea how to use landmarks or other natural ways to attract players attention.

 

[Lee__Kanker]

I agree, but I feel its not just because "dumb modern audiences", often is just a way to mask poor design like having to talk to a specific RANDOM npc to progress story or having super detailed environments filled with computers and other objects, but only one of then can actually be interacted with. Like, if you actually removed the quest compass from one of these modern games, there would be no way to know where to go because the developers are too lazy to have the npcs actually give you directions and have no idea how to use landmarks or other natural ways to attract players attention.

The way stuff is designed makes me think mainstream devs think the average player has 50 attention deficit disorders and cant do anything unless it requires 0 focus because they're already watching a youtube essay and their tiktok playlist while playing their game and if you ask them to stop they're gonna screech violently

And I was right

Plus Ive had developers on twitter tell me the players will miss stuff during playtesting if they dont use the yellow paint, they dont think it's their fault for making the enviroment so cluttered, they dont look at how older games do it, and they think a player missing stuff and having to try again is a bad thing; it's a whole mentality

 

[dropsmegamega]

The way stuff is designed makes me think mainstream devs think the average player has 50 attention deficit disorders and cant do anything unless it requires 0 focus because they're already watching a youtube essay and their tiktok playlist while playing their game and if you ask them to stop they're gonna screech violently

Plus Ive had developers on twitter tell me the players will miss stuff during playtesting if they dont use the yellow paint, they dont think it's their fault for making the enviroment so cluttered, they dont look at how older games do it, and they think a player missing stuff and having to try again is a bad thing; it's a whole mentality

Simply surreal. These are the kind of designers that got pissed at the success of Elden Ring.

Is also ironic that with this kind of mindset, devs of these linear cinematic games still are too pretentious to actually commit to the obvious solution: drop the cutscenes so the game no longer keeps switching between passive(waiting, watching) and active(doing stuff) states which probably is the biggest contradiction in their game design. Or just go make movies I guess.

 

[Lee__Kanker]

Simply surreal. These are the kind of designers that got pissed at the success of Elden Ring.

Is also ironic that with this kind of mindset, devs of these linear cinematic games still are too pretentious to actually commit to the obvious solution: drop the cutscenes so the game no longer keeps switching between passive(waiting, watching) and active(doing stuff) states which probably is the biggest contradiction in their game design. Or just go make movies I guess.

As a huge fan of devil may cry, bayonetta and silent hill I've always been a proponent of cutscene. But the way they use them...

Devil May Cry uses cutscenes to contextualize and build up the combat, for example

At this point in the game you've never seen an enemy this big, the camera is looking up at the first boss to make you feel threatened like "how am I gonna do this??" yet Dante not only remains calm but mocks him, telling the player how strong your character is if this doesnt even phase him. Then theres this stupendous transition from demo (jap term for cutscene) to gameplay, completly seamless and it also gives you an idea of how this first boss will attack you. You are also meant to die on this boss if you havent mastered the game as it is the game's n00b killer (he has armor so you cant spam the attack button, it has reflectable projectiles that will kill you in 2-3 hits, it can jump on you if you try to run away, you fight it in a cramped space..)

After your final battle with it, the boss is looking up at YOU, in awe at your skills. He seemed impossible at first but now the player is as confident as Dante when he bids him "sweet dreams"

The battle wouldnt have been so memorable if you just encountered it with the game camera with no dialogue, instead he's one of my fav bosses ever. And as the game is meant to be replayed you can just instantly skip it with one button so it doesnt interrupt the flow of the game if you're speeding through it

Modern devs just dont use demos like this, they want to use em to stop everything so they can beat you over the head with how profound and relatable their characters are and how this is a statement or whatever so video essayist can salivate all over it, the gameplay and mechanics are secondary, they'll just use the same mechanics as the last famous game that came out so no player will complain about having to learn new stuff and thats a 10/10. Mainstream players and review sites couldnt care less about mechanics, it's all about playing it once getting their deep ending and moving onto the next game