Dreamcast Lukewarm Take: The Dreamcast controller is good.

[Leon]

I think the dreamcast controller sucked personally, honestly all they had to do is add 2 sticks to the 6 button saturn controller, and maybe add some analog functionality to it, sad it took 8bitdo, a third party and over 2 decades to finally get a 6 button version of the saturn controller.

 

[Zerpina]

I think the dreamcast controller sucked personally, honestly all they had to do is add 2 sticks to the 6 button saturn controller, and maybe add some analog functionality to it, sad it took 8bitdo, a third party and over 2 decades to finally get a 6 button version of the saturn controller.

Well, you have to look at it, from the Time Period as well.
At that point in time, Not a lot of Games where using 1 Analog stick, Let alone two. yes Looking back now it seems Silly, but that's Hindsight.

SEGA, probably didn't see much point in a Second stick, and as, i forget who said it, Had the DC Lasted they would probably Redesigned it with a Second.

 

[beowulf848]

For me, the ergonomics of the DC controller are horrible. I have hands on the larger size and trying to hold that controller comfortably is near impossible for me.

 

[prnzo x BOOZE-o ka-BEER-o]

I think the dreamcast controller sucked personally, honestly all they had to do is add 2 sticks to the 6 button saturn controller, and maybe add some analog functionality to it, sad it took 8bitdo, a third party and over 2 decades to finally get a 6 button version of the saturn controller.

Post automatically merged: Jan 22, 2025

^^
Exhibit A: DC pad OG
Exhibit B: DC pad Madcatz... 6-button face + triggers

 

[Somnia]

I love the Dreamcast but going from the Saturn 3D pad to the Dreamcast pad always hurts. The parts feel cheap on DC alongside not having 6 face buttons, a hugely downgraded dpad and an analog stick that just never really felt great to me in terms of grip and general feel.

Then there's the issue of it lacking a second stick (imagine Quake 3 or Unreal with that stick), only 2 triggers and no L3/R3 type function on the stick it does have. Its true that developers designed around it but the fact that they had to do so at all is just disappointing. Sega just seems to have been so clueless when it came to where console gaming was going. Not recognizing 3D was the future with Saturn until the last minute and then not recognizing that dual analog was gonna become standard.

If the Dreamcast lived a longer life to receive more multiplatform games people would see just how damning the Dreamcast missing up to 4 buttons and a stick really is. Again I adore the DC but even when compared to the Saturn 3D pad it feels like such a downgrade. The DC pad feels slightly more ergonomic in terms of size (plus I love the colors) but Saturn's had better buttons, a best-in-class dpad as expected and a far comfier stick imo. Just wish Sega would have copied that pad's quality instead of downgrading every aspect and adding nothing new aside from the (very cool) cart slots for stuff like VMUs and rumble. But again, Sega was bleeding money so I get that it had to be a cheaper unit.

This is purely subjective but I also tend to prefer heavier controllers so the DC pad being so light is a turn-off tho ultimately not a big deal once you have a couple carts in the back.

Wire placement was never a problem for me though. No clue why people still say that like it ever actually comes up while playing. I struggle to think of a scenario where having it in the front vs the back becomes a problem.

Can we stop calling it the Xbox layout, and start calling it the Dreamcast layout? They did it first didn't they?

The layouts of DC and Xbox aren't that similar though, are they? They share a left stick and dpad placement but aside from that they're just different beasts.

In any case, Sega helped out on the Xbox so I'm sure the similarities are because of that relationship. History also tends to remember the victor and in casual spaces most people don't have any experience with the DC so I understand the confusion.

 

[ifelloffmybike]

I love the Dreamcast but going from the Saturn 3D pad to the Dreamcast pad always hurts. The parts feel cheap on DC alongside not having 6 face buttons, a hugely downgraded dpad and an analog stick that just never really felt great to me in terms of grip and general feel.

Then there's the issue of it lacking a second stick (imagine Quake 3 or Unreal with that stick), only 2 triggers and no L3/R3 type function on the stick it does have. Its true that developers designed around it but the fact that they had to do so at all is just disappointing. Sega just seems to have been so clueless when it came to where console gaming was going. Not recognizing 3D was the future with Saturn until the last minute and then not recognizing that dual analog was gonna become standard.

If the Dreamcast lived a longer life to receive more multiplatform games people would see just how damning the Dreamcast missing up to 4 buttons and a stick really is. Again I adore the DC but even when compared to the Saturn 3D pad it feels like such a downgrade. The DC pad feels slightly more ergonomic in terms of size (plus I love the colors) but Saturn's had better buttons, a best-in-class dpad as expected and a far comfier stick imo. Just wish Sega would have copied that pad's quality instead of downgrading every aspect and adding nothing new aside from the (very cool) cart slots for stuff like VMUs and rumble. But again, Sega was bleeding money so I get that it had to be a cheaper unit.

This is purely subjective but I also tend to prefer heavier controllers so the DC pad being so light is a turn-off tho ultimately not a big deal once you have a couple carts in the back.

Wire placement was never a problem for me though. No clue why people still say that like it ever actually comes up while playing. I struggle to think of a scenario where having it in the front vs the back becomes a problem.


The layouts of DC and Xbox aren't that similar though, are they? They share a left stick and dpad placement but aside from that they're just different beasts.

In any case, Sega helped out on the Xbox so I'm sure the similarities are because of that relationship. History also tends to remember the victor and in casual spaces most people don't have any experience with the DC so I understand the confusion.

Now that's one i haven't heard before. The sega saturn 3D controller purely from images looks like an unruly beast. But despite my best efforts, i've never held or used any part of a sega saturn in any way. So i cannot really comment on the quality of those controllers Vs. the Dreamcasts. However the Dreamcast controller has never felt cheap to me. Especially the analog stick has always felt really nice. Plus its hall effect which i dont know if the saturn's is.

It was said earlier in the thread that there would've likely been an upgrade to the controller that added more things like the PS1 had with the dualshock. I agree with that notion, as the 6th generation was the defining generation for controls that we use today. Especially if the Dreamcast ever hoped for ports of things from the Xbox and PS2. Although there would've been no way for that to be backwards compatible with already released games, so i'm curious how they would've gone about that. Maybe offer some internet based updates for existing games somehow? Or reprint discs to either show they arent compatible with the second stick or fully implement compatibility for their more famous titles like Sonic Adventure and Jet Grind Radio?

I have smaller hands and i always have so i don't run into a hand cramp or space problem on the Dreamcast. I also dont have an issue with its weight but i understand how some could have one.

 

[Somnia]

Now that's one i haven't heard before. The sega saturn 3D controller purely from images looks like an unruly beast. But despite my best efforts, i've never held or used any part of a sega saturn in any way. So i cannot really comment on the quality of those controllers Vs. the Dreamcasts. However the Dreamcast controller has never felt cheap to me. Especially the analog stick has always felt really nice. Plus its hall effect which i dont know if the saturn's is.

It was said earlier in the thread that there would've likely been an upgrade to the controller that added more things like the PS1 had with the dualshock. I agree with that notion, as the 6th generation was the defining generation for controls that we use today. Especially if the Dreamcast ever hoped for ports of things from the Xbox and PS2. Although there would've been no way for that to be backwards compatible with already released games, so i'm curious how they would've gone about that. Maybe offer some internet based updates for existing games somehow? Or reprint discs to either show they arent compatible with the second stick or fully implement compatibility for their more famous titles like Sonic Adventure and Jet Grind Radio?

I have smaller hands and i always have so i don't run into a hand cramp or space problem on the Dreamcast. I also dont have an issue with its weight but i understand how some could have one.

Saturn pad was actually the first hall effect pad ever! Sega was so cool :,)

If they did have a controller upgrade Im sure it would've went down like the Genesis 6 button pad or Dualshock did where old games just can't use it and newer games can choose to have compatibility or not. You're right that some games could have potentially had patches if they featured internet connectivity in some way. Woulda been pretty neat to see!

 

[zacharinolongpants]

The VMU is the sickest thing ever lol. I love that thing. Dope controller for that VMU slot alone.

 

[Zooey]

The layouts of DC and Xbox aren't that similar though, are they? They share a left stick and dpad placement but aside from that they're just different beasts.

In any case, Sega helped out on the Xbox so I'm sure the similarities are because of that relationship. History also tends to remember the victor and in casual spaces most people don't have any experience with the DC so I understand the confusion.

Xbox Layout i believe refers to the position of the ABXY buttons, as opposed to Nintendo's ABXY layout from the SNES. The Dreamcast shares the same ABXY layout as the Xbox, but predates it. I assume the main reason why we call it the Xbox layout is because ABXY layouts didnt get much consideration until recently, and that the Xbox is a far more popular console than the Dreamcast was.

Post automatically merged: Jan 22, 2025

Actually, you are Correct.
Dreamcast - November 27, 1998 <Japan>
XBOX - November 15, 2001 <USA>
Even if we go by the U.S. Release of the DC, it came out on 9/9/99 So yes, Sega did do it First

The reason i think people Call it the Xbox Layout, the Dreamcast's Controller, is kinda Forgotten by 90% of people. and or Misremember the OG Xbox as coming out before the DC. People here, for the most part Don't, but i actully had to look up when the OG Xbox came out <knew the DC did but couldn't Recall what year the OGXB came out>

And the XBOX is more ingrained in Gaming history Memory than the DC has been for Along time now, due to it's short Lifespan. Sad but True.

I thought maybe it was because less syllables, but nope, Xbox and Dreamcast are both 2 syllables. So I figured it had to have been due to popularity reasons why its called the Xbox layout instead of the Dreamcast layout, even though it was something Dreamcast came up with first.

 

[prnzo x BOOZE-o ka-BEER-o]

ok... nobody saw the 6-button face Dreamcast controller up above^^ ... have a blue one n a green one but anyway (not mad at anything it's chill here)... just for S&G:

Post automatically merged: Jan 22, 2025

Exhibit C&D. or something to that pretentious effect xD

 

[tempest2k]

never held a dreamcast controller but it looks awesome imo

 

[WillowWisps]

100% Agree. Would a second joystick be beneficial? Of course it would be but it also accomplishes it's goals pretty well for 1999. I would go so far as to say for some games it is preferable (personally) then a modern substitute. For reference I did not own one growing up and did not until I was in my middle 20's so it is NOT nostalgia talking for me.

Post automatically merged: Jan 22, 2025

The lack of a second analog stick already felt dated by the time of its introduction and made plenty of titles an absolute chore to play (like Quake 3) and what really adds to the grievances people had with it is that the Dualshock was already out by then (It released in late 1997)

Quake was not meant for a controller two joystick or otherwise. This is why it had KBM support on hardware.

 

[prnzo x BOOZE-o ka-BEER-o]

never held a dreamcast controller but it looks awesome imo

your name... you ever play the Jaguar version of Tempest 2000?

 

[Somnia]

Quake was not meant for a controller two joystick or otherwise. This is why it had KBM support on hardware.

This is true but it also misses the point that the game would have just controlled better with a second analog stick. If you play Quake 3 Revolution on PS2 you'll instantly feel how much smoother the game is despite the lack of sophisticated aim assist.

Regardless of if a game is purpose built for another peripheral, it's always better to have the actual controller the system comes with to be a great way to play. The DC pad was serviceable for the FPS games it had, but the DC deserved a pad that was more than serviceable. If a racing game came out and controlled poorly on pad for whatever reason, telling me "Well it was designed for a wheel accessory" isn't gonna stop me from feeling miffed, ya know?

 

[fishboneKiller]

people often complain about the lack of a second stick, but for the most part there arent THAT many games that warrant it. the only (released) example i can think of is Quake 3, where they commit a war crime by putting movement on the face buttons and camera controls on the analog stick, but even that has mouse and keyboard support, and it's a port anyways. most exclusives ive played (D2 and Shenmue) felt fine without a second stick, at least to me.

 

[tempest2k]

your name... you ever play the Jaguar version of Tempest 2000?

i haven't seen even a screenshot of jaguar tempest 2000 let alone seen an atari jaguar in real life

 

[The_Real_Thing]

I modded one of mine years ago to have the cord come out of the front, next to the VMU slot. I also doubled the length of the cord while I was at it. It fit a need at the time. Also: I played through all of Half-Life with this thing. It's not like it's an N64 controller (those sticks are self-destructing trash, and I had 4 of them).

 

[ifelloffmybike]

I modded one of mine years ago to have the cord come out of the front, next to the VMU slot. I also doubled the length of the cord while I was at it. It fit a need at the time. Also: I played through all of Half-Life with this thing. It's not like it's an N64 controller (those sticks are self-destructing trash, and I had 4 of them).

I gotta say i never expected nearly this many replies to my first forum thread on here, but this one is definitely the most unique of them all so far. Never have a seen a whole controller mold mod just for a change in the wire placement lol. But that's pretty cool! And yeah. The N64 was my first console and i've gone through about 3 controllers or so in my lifetime, and fixed another three once i learned how to replace sticks. I will take the Dreamcast controller over the N64 controller ANY day purely from the "not destroying itself every movement you make" factor.

 

[xman8245]

xbox controllers are literally exactly the same, so yes.

 

[ciro64]

Here's a hot take: the right stick made developers lazy. I love automatic cameras.

 

[Ikagura]

I'll forever miss the DC and GC L and R buttons.

Too bad they kinda dropped it aside from the Triggers on the Xbox 360.

 

[hazys]

I will always defend the Dreamcast's D-stick. It's stiff by design! But the D-pad is indefensible.

 

[The_Real_Thing]

I gotta say i never expected nearly this many replies to my first forum thread on here, but this one is definitely the most unique of them all so far. Never have a seen a whole controller mold mod just for a change in the wire placement lol. But that's pretty cool! And yeah. The N64 was my first console and i've gone through about 3 controllers or so in my lifetime, and fixed another three once i learned how to replace sticks. I will take the Dreamcast controller over the N64 controller ANY day purely from the "not destroying itself every movement you make" factor.

It was fairly simple. I think I used a drill to make hole(s) for the re-route and some hot glue as a poor-man's strain relief on the inside (so it'd be tougher to pull out by accident). Ugly, but effective, lol, and it held fine for years. IIRC that side of the VMU slot allowed for easiest placement of a hole without breaking anything.

An aside: I did a mod on the Xbox S-type controller to add a USB Type-A cable to the stock plug. Only had to pop the plug apart and drill a tiny hole for the cable to come out of the top of the plug. Just soldered 4 wires to matching colors, very simple. Auto-detects in linux (using with Batocera rig these days) or in Windows with a driver install, but I just use a 360 controller on PC because ubiquity in gaming. *nods*

 

[therealRonneberg]

The Dreamcast controller looks weird the first time you see it definitely not helped by the cord going into the wrong direction.
But once you start actually using it, it works really well. I played trough RE 2, 3 and CV recently and can't even complain about the D-Pad.

 

[Parasite_Steve]

I actually find it a little more comfortable than other controllers of the time and the d-pad is surprisingly precise, but I can’t defend the analog stick and the limited layout reached its limits before the console did. Still, for games that made good use of its limitations it was a pretty good, surprisingly influential controller.