It’s haunted me for a while, and it’s become something I’ve become more aware of as I go on my massive SEGA rampage, but games are one of the only mediums where sales figures matter in discussions for some reason. Sure, you usually want to say the movie, show, novel, or music you love did numbers, but usually the thing most accepted by the masses is looked down upon. That perspective can be nonsense too (something being popular doesn’t make it somehow watered down), but it’s even more ridiculous in my eyes to claim that something doing poor commercially somehow makes it a worse piece of art.
Like, really ask yourself: with so many games to play and so many platforms to play them on, isn’t something great BOUND to fall through the cracks? Isn’t a console just bound to be the odd one out? This perspective is less common with the PC space, probably because games there have less pressure to do well financially because there’s less risk for releasing on PC, but what is the big push STILL with console sales? And why use them as a measure of how good or bad something is? If you don’t like it, you should be searching to define your issue with it, not saying “it didn’t sell as well as the thing I like, so therefore my thing is better!”
It just seems like playground politics to me, and we should focus more on what cool things each individual game has rather than trying to say “this thing has more value than this thing and therefore that thing is awful and should never be played”.
Games are fun. Play game. Share with people what you’ve played. There’s not many ways to play games “wrong” unless you are actively wasting your time (playing something you don’t actually like playing for whatever reason you may have) or becoming obsessed (playing something so much that you have an unhealthy attachment to it).
Games are fun. Play game. Share with people what you’ve played. There’s not many ways to play games “wrong” unless you are actively wasting your time (playing something you don’t actually like playing for whatever reason you may have) or becoming obsessed (playing something so much that you have an unhealthy attachment to it).
This is basically it for me, I bought these consoles to play games on it, I can't control what people gonna buy so if I like it I'll buy, thats it, I'm doing my part.
It may be a case of some people being insecure even when it comes to something like video games...which are something we should enjoy without looking at sales or numbers!!!!
In my case, I get a bit bored with discussions about sales results and statistics because I only focus the true value of a game on its quality or a console on its catalog.
(Although I recognize that knowing it as trivia data can be interesting, depending on the context)
It's just nonsense people bring up because they think it "wins" arguments and distracts from evaluating a game on it's own merits, and in some cases it's to say that they're arguing on the side of good/normal people while the other side of the argument is weirdos/outcasts who should not be taken seriously.
Game sales sound like they "mean" something but they don't mean anything more than the game sold that ammount of copies, they don't even tell you the price it sold out or anything.
And also if you are posting about games online, you are probably NOT normal haha. Stop trying to pretend.
All I can say is it's how their brain works. Fans often use the argument of "this game is objectively good because it sold millions" as because it's how their brain works they can't comprehend how a person doesn't like that popular game as if there is something wrong with their head.
This is fundamentally about why sense of normal and the opinion of the majority causes a sense of objectivity despite the objectivity is nonsense like it's "world is flat" as objectivity is commonly believed subjectivity among majority of people so objectivity doesn't have to be about what is real as facts can be not true, however for majority objectivity is what you should obey to be normal.
We can trace it back to the sense of being alone due to being abnormal is a sign of being vulnerable due to side effect of being social animals as this is the reality humanity evolved for millions of years therefore people giving so much importance to what people think -> what most people does -> "how correct we are when we are like how everyone is despite we throw our daughters into volcano just to don't anger gods". Apparently sacrificing our daughters is better than people thinking ill about us lol and that's why traditions are dead important and it's the worst thing to do when you break norms wow. Not to mention most people cannot lose their insanity they suffer from due to teenage and therefore teen pressure as they grow up to be proud educated fools who live like kids in adult life, their brains filled with technical knowledge so they can do their job but they have no sense of self whatsoever as they using whatever persona is the most popular instead of being who they are so no wonder to them what matters is not "I like/dislike this game", they all care about "of course I would like a game that sold a million ha ha" and "damn how can you like this game that only has 100 reviews on Steam and mostly they are negative? Are you attempting to be the broken fork to feel special snowflake?".
It's all because some people cannot form an opinion of their own as their subjectivity cannot exist without a sense of objectivity they believe in as they rely on group thinking to don't lose their grip in their insane sanity lol, because of it politicians and companies trying to create their own sense of objectivity to fool people by distorting reality as this is how advertizing and propaganda works. So one of the ways is "our game sold millions" if you can believe it. Review manipulation is obvious in this world so can you trust how much a game sold? Regardless people do buy video games just because it's popular and then they forget the game's existence without even caring to play it. They feel great about how normal they are by buying that popular game, otherwise their friends would think ill about them. "Ah, man it was worth to preorder that game that sold millions already despite I don't even care about that game, now how will I pay my rent for this month by still seeming like I'm not poor while I'm with my friends?" — insanity of majority you should be to be normal lmao.
In that regard one of the worst thing happened in video game industry is video game companies realized they can sell a lot by just creating a hype despite they use false advertizing and releasing a game that requires years of fixing, and it's atomic explosion of sale guarantee when you release anime of your game. As a result all we have is empty rubbish programs that sold millions as pseudo-video games people buy but not many actually plays. And then new generation kids grew up thinking a video game having BS gacha system, nonsense DLCs, microtransactions, "wait for a day to play again" F2P games, being broken therefore needs years of fixing despite $80 price tag and whatnot BS as how video games should be because it's what is normal to them as this is a good example of how brainwashing works. Then it all fell to the "everyone plays it, so I have to play it" mentality. Then they eat their father's head and go to a shop that sells computers then the kid is like "dude does this PC can run Valorant? Otherwise I don't wanna buy it. Valorant has millions of players and also deez nuts yo" lol.
“it didn’t sell as well as the thing I like, so therefore my thing is better!”
It just seems like playground politics to me, and we should focus more on what cool things each individual game has rather than trying to say “this thing has more value than this thing and therefore that thing is awful and should never be played”.
some people don't mentally progress past this point.
i would say ignore those people. they wouldn't know anything about good quality products and stories if you falcon punched a full powered donkey kong punch into their face.
And it’s okay to not be normal. It’s okay to love what you love. But, in the not being normal, you have to analyze yourself and ask “am I being HEALTHY?” and if you aren’t, you need to think about the consequences of what you’ve done and could do.
It’s crazy but it’s the truth. All these people talking about games online in the last generation, all the AVGN clones and later game reviewer circuit, they shaped the narrative for the people younger then them. The folks that were just young enough to not have been around for the times these folks were discussing. And it sucks to put that fault onto anybody, but that’s what being a grown up is all about: considering the consequences because you’ve lived long enough to have seen what happens.
I’m happy to know that a bunch of folks from my generation, and we’re so very far from perfect, but a lot of us said “hang on. I like that game. I like that console. I don’t think that’s what actually happened in history. Hold up, we’ve gotta correct the narrative real quick because we don’t want a warped perspective on an art form that already is struggling to gain respect.”
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And, in addendum, I want to remind folks my age to take a look at the effect your words and work are having, especially on younger people who may stumble into them. If you see an effect you don’t like: hard correct. Because the younger generation, whoever they are, deserve a better discussion than the one you’re in right now. And that’s law for all things, not just games.
some people don't mentally progress past this point.
i would say ignore those people. they wouldn't know anything about good quality products and stories if you falcon punched a full powered donkey kong punch into their face.
All I can say is it's how their brain works. Fans often use the argument of "this game is objectively good because it sold millions" as because it's how their brain works they can't comprehend how a person doesn't like that popular game as if there is something wrong with their head.
This is fundamentally about why sense of normal and the opinion of the majority causes a sense of objectivity despite the objectivity is nonsense like it's "world is flat" as objectivity is commonly believed subjectivity among majority of people so objectivity doesn't have to be about what is real as facts can be not true, however for majority objectivity is what you should obey to be normal.
We can trace it back to the sense of being alone due to being abnormal is a sign of being vulnerable due to side effect of being social animals as this is the reality humanity evolved for millions of years therefore people giving so much importance to what people think -> what most people does -> "how correct we are when we are like how everyone is despite we throw our daughters into volcano just to don't anger gods". Apparently sacrificing our daughters is better than people thinking ill about us lol and that's why traditions are dead important and it's the worst thing to do when you break norms wow. Not to mention most people cannot lose their insanity they suffer from due to teenage and therefore teen pressure as they grow up to be proud educated fools who live like kids in adult life, their brains filled with technical knowledge so they can do their job but they have no sense of self whatsoever as they using whatever persona is the most popular instead of being who they are so no wonder to them what matters is not "I like/dislike this game", they all care about "of course I would like a game that sold a million ha ha" and "damn how can you like this game that only has 100 reviews on Steam and mostly they are negative? Are you attempting to be the broken fork to feel special snowflake?".
It's all because some people cannot form an opinion of their own as their subjectivity cannot exist without a sense of objectivity they believe in as they rely on group thinking to don't lose their grip in their insane sanity lol, because of it politicians and companies trying to create their own sense of objectivity to fool people by distorting reality as this is how advertizing and propaganda works. So one of the ways is "our game sold millions" if you can believe it. Review manipulation is obvious in this world so can you trust how much a game sold? Regardless people do buy video games just because it's popular and then they forget the game's existence without even caring to play it. They feel great about how normal they are by buying that popular game, otherwise their friends would think ill about them. "Ah, man it was worth to preorder that game that sold millions already despite I don't even care about that game, now how will I pay my rent for this month by still seeming like I'm not poor while I'm with my friends?" — insanity of majority you should be to be normal lmao.
In that regard one of the worst thing happened in video game industry is video game companies realized they can sell a lot by just creating a hype despite they use false advertizing and releasing a game that requires years of fixing, and it's atomic explosion of sale guarantee when you release anime of your game. As a result all we have is empty rubbish programs that sold millions as pseudo-video games people buy but not many actually plays. And then new generation kids grew up thinking a video game having BS gacha system, nonsense DLCs, microtransactions, "wait for a day to play again" F2P games, being broken therefore needs years of fixing despite $80 price tag and whatnot BS as how video games should be because it's what is normal to them as this is a good example of how brainwashing works. Then it all fell to the "everyone plays it, so I have to play it" mentality. Then they eat their father's head and go to a shop that sells computers then the kid is like "dude does this PC can run Valorant? Otherwise I don't wanna buy it. Valorant has millions of players and also deez nuts yo" lol.
I keep replying to these… my post is going to be longer than Harada’s typical post!
Gotta say, as somebody who was unfortunate enough to grow up with Skylanders, I felt that. Hard. The gimmick is cool, I’ll give it that all day, but the practice of that game was super scummy. Straight up. And it’s not good enough to justify it, especially when playing alone. You kind of have to play in co-op to get anything out of it.
They sold you a half built Lego set, basically. And then they said “oh, by the way, to complete the already expensive game you just bought (which isn’t great, by the way), that’s going to cost you extra. That’ll be $300, please.”
That game is dead. The tactic is not. It evolved. It’s the idea of: “don’t unlock. Pay.” And the longer it goes on, the more it becomes normal because people grow up with it and don’t know a world without it.
I’m thankful we’re keeping the spirit of retro games alive, if for no other reason than to let younger folks know that true ownership is worth fighting for. Take control of YOUR LIFE. And don’t let anybody, especially not a company, dictate that life for you.
if it's smash rules, then they would most likely cancel each other out. i would say that dk might have a higher strength stat than captain falcon, but falcon might have higher stamina due to the extreme racing he does and probably a higher speed stat from being a bounty hunter. dk would win if he gets lots of hits in but if captain falcon can dodge enough, he can get a lot of hits in and chip away until he can land a decisive blow.
if it's smash rules, then they would most likely cancel each other out. i would say that dk might have a higher strength stat than captain falcon, but falcon might have higher stamina due to the extreme racing he does and probably a higher speed stat from being a bounty hunter. dk would win if he gets lots of hits in but if captain falcon can dodge enough, he can get a lot of hits in and chip away until he can land a decisive blow.
Well becuse there is no point in putting your money in to something that is a failure. Today it´s like this if a game sales badly you know several things.
1. It must be very bad or unoriginal. So not worth your time.
2. If a game does badly it most likely will not get any feature update so it could be left with allot of bugs even game breaking ones.
3. A game that sell badly means no DLC no sequel.
So if games is gonna gost 80-100 "which companies want" Well as a consumer you don´t want to invest if the game is gonna be broken or get no feature attention.
Look at Concord the bade sales ended up killing to game so fast and well sell numbers warned people this game is not gonna be around for much longer so it saved people money.
It´s not playground politics it´s important for consumers not to waste their time nor their money. But hey you you have money to throw on every shit game out there no one is stopping you.
playground politics that is what the western game companies when their trash game sell badly the blame their consumers said it´s our fault the game did poorly and not that they made a game no one wanted.
We gamer´s are not some form of charity that hands out money to what ever company that thing they have a brilliant idea for a game. Hence why games like Concord, Failguard, Forspoken did badly and the sail numbers basically gave every one simple Waring don´t waste your time nor money. You don´t even need a review to know if a AAA game is bad when it can´t even out sell an inide game made by 30 people.
Sale numbers is a warning system especially when it comes to mmo and live service games.
The only thing that sales numbers don´t work on is indie game they will have low numbers for many reason and people understand it. But when it comes to AAA companies it´s a good warning system to keep away.
Well becuse there is no point in putting your money in to something that is a failure. Today it´s like this if a game sales badly you know several things.
1. It must be very bad or unoriginal. So not worth your time.
2. If a game does badly it most likely will not get any feature update so it could be left with allot of bugs even game breaking ones.
3. A game that sell badly means no DLC no sequel.
So if games is gonna gost 80-100 "which companies want" Well as a consumer you don´t want to invest if the game is gonna be broken or get no feature attention.
Look at Concord the bade sales ended up killing to game so fast and well sell numbers warned people this game is not gonna be around for much longer so it saved people money.
It´s not playground politics it´s important for consumers not to waste their time nor their money. But hey you you have money to throw on every shit game out there no one is stopping you.
playground politics that is what the western game companies when their trash game sell badly the blame their consumers said it´s our fault the game did poorly and not that they made a game no one wanted.
We gamer´s are not some form of charity that hands out money to what ever company that thing they have a brilliant idea for a game. Hence why games like Concord, Failguard, Forspoken did badly and the sail numbers basically gave every one simple Waring don´t waste your time nor money. You don´t even need a review to know if a AAA game is bad when it can´t even out sell an inide game made by 30 people.
Sale numbers is a warning system especially when it comes to mmo and live service games.
The only thing that sales numbers don´t work on is indie game they will have low numbers for many reason and people understand it. But when it comes to AAA companies it´s a good warning system to keep away.
I do have to ask in that case why the most popular titles in terms of raw numbers are all titles which have what you just listed. Somebody above explained the dangers of hype, which absolutely plays a role.
My point remains: the games that stick with you longest are sometimes the ones that barely sold. The games that slide off your brain the most are sometimes the ones that have the largest followings.
Sales numbers don’t mean ANYTHING other than “did a game have hype behind it?” Hype can be good or bad. It can go for or against you, and it is a concept so it does not care. Hype can, will, and does drive game sales to be as big as they can be. Whether or not it’s warranted is occasionally unrelated.
Sure hyped as very very common factor that can inflate or deflate sales numbers. Which why I don´t buy in to it. I remember before Cyberpunk came out and how people where so hyped and got pissed at when when I said don´t be sure it will be the best gamer ever. And well we all know how the launch was or the first 2 years. And I like Cyberpunk today mind you. But I learned to have low expectation today.
But that´s the issue people over hyped a games and been burned allot so today, So allot of people use sales number to know if they wanna invest in the game or not becuse they don´t wanna be burned again.
And as I said it´s an important part for mmo and live service game because if they do poorly the server will be shut down and when it comes to mmo game you invest shit load of money and hours in to it and you don´t wanna do what just for the server to shut down 6-12 months later.
And as you see with failguard becuse it´s poor sale number well it will not get any massive DLC´or such. The game is basicly abadon by the company. And if a game has any game breaking bus well your stuck with that. There exist games that you can never beta becuse if the game never got fixed becuse it was abadon becuse it did not make the coampny any money.
This is basically it for me, I bought these consoles to play games on it, I can't control what people gonna buy so if I like it I'll buy, thats it, I'm doing my part.
And if somebody wants to get on you for liking something that’s financially unpopular, and I’m so safe with my language so this should ring strong, then FUCK ‘EM!
Should go without saying, but it demands repeating.
All I can say is it's how their brain works. Fans often use the argument of "this game is objectively good because it sold millions" as because it's how their brain works they can't comprehend how a person doesn't like that popular game as if there is something wrong with their head.
This is fundamentally about why sense of normal and the opinion of the majority causes a sense of objectivity despite the objectivity is nonsense like it's "world is flat" as objectivity is commonly believed subjectivity among majority of people so objectivity doesn't have to be about what is real as facts can be not true, however for majority objectivity is what you should obey to be normal.
We can trace it back to the sense of being alone due to being abnormal is a sign of being vulnerable due to side effect of being social animals as this is the reality humanity evolved for millions of years therefore people giving so much importance to what people think -> what most people does -> "how correct we are when we are like how everyone is despite we throw our daughters into volcano just to don't anger gods". Apparently sacrificing our daughters is better than people thinking ill about us lol and that's why traditions are dead important and it's the worst thing to do when you break norms wow. Not to mention most people cannot lose their insanity they suffer from due to teenage and therefore teen pressure as they grow up to be proud educated fools who live like kids in adult life, their brains filled with technical knowledge so they can do their job but they have no sense of self whatsoever as they using whatever persona is the most popular instead of being who they are so no wonder to them what matters is not "I like/dislike this game", they all care about "of course I would like a game that sold a million ha ha" and "damn how can you like this game that only has 100 reviews on Steam and mostly they are negative? Are you attempting to be the broken fork to feel special snowflake?".
It's all because some people cannot form an opinion of their own as their subjectivity cannot exist without a sense of objectivity they believe in as they rely on group thinking to don't lose their grip in their insane sanity lol, because of it politicians and companies trying to create their own sense of objectivity to fool people by distorting reality as this is how advertizing and propaganda works. So one of the ways is "our game sold millions" if you can believe it. Review manipulation is obvious in this world so can you trust how much a game sold? Regardless people do buy video games just because it's popular and then they forget the game's existence without even caring to play it. They feel great about how normal they are by buying that popular game, otherwise their friends would think ill about them. "Ah, man it was worth to preorder that game that sold millions already despite I don't even care about that game, now how will I pay my rent for this month by still seeming like I'm not poor while I'm with my friends?" — insanity of majority you should be to be normal lmao.
In that regard one of the worst thing happened in video game industry is video game companies realized they can sell a lot by just creating a hype despite they use false advertizing and releasing a game that requires years of fixing, and it's atomic explosion of sale guarantee when you release anime of your game. As a result all we have is empty rubbish programs that sold millions as pseudo-video games people buy but not many actually plays. And then new generation kids grew up thinking a video game having BS gacha system, nonsense DLCs, microtransactions, "wait for a day to play again" F2P games, being broken therefore needs years of fixing despite $80 price tag and whatnot BS as how video games should be because it's what is normal to them as this is a good example of how brainwashing works. Then it all fell to the "everyone plays it, so I have to play it" mentality. Then they eat their father's head and go to a shop that sells computers then the kid is like "dude does this PC can run Valorant? Otherwise I don't wanna buy it. Valorant has millions of players and also deez nuts yo" lol.
Games are one of the only forms of art that you NEED to buy before enjoying them. Paintings are displayed in galleries for everyone to look at, music nowadays is played either on the radio or through streaming services, it's almost the same with movies.
You can't really rent a physical game anymore (or at least most people cannot) and there are so many games that can't be played unless you've owned them when they release, with the appropriate hardware.
I know I've gotten out of the point but I what I want to say is, games are just different to all other media we consume. They usually get judged by how much they have sold because people that are willing to play the game NEED to buy it, and you can't track how many people have pirated those games.
Too bad this is not a great way to judge how good a game is.
for no other reason than to let younger folks know that true ownership is worth fighting for. Take control of YOUR LIFE. And don’t let anybody, especially not a company, dictate that life for you.
Unfortunately people who lack a sense of self love to be told what to do, their lives being decided for them as they see how life is easy when they just follow whatever is popular and being the echo of what others say. Perhaps especially because of the internet culture people are more subjected to being brainwashed by companies and politicians as they are more vulnerable to how they distort reality. As a result most people assume whatever persona that seems cool and popular on the internet as they act like badly written NPCs pretty much saying the same, attacking the same and defending the same. You can see how new generation of kids defends the bad practices of companies despite they are being clearly scammed and fooled over and over, as a result they turn into "unpaid shills" they copy-paste ideas from the actual shills without actually being aware as their main weapon is "the game sold millions so your negative opinion has no effect at all". How much a video game sold became a tool as this is a political version of "how you call our president a dictator and say he doesn't care if people can survive with minimum wage when he built roads here and there". So any video game is necessarily good if it sold like 2 million, and any politician is good if they are the reason some roads were built wow lol.
Recently only attempt of the new generation kids to wake up from their ignorant opinions in the context of video game industry was when Ubisoft removed The Crew from their library. Despite this there were shills and unpaid shills who really defended "but the game was designed to be online only" to "video game companies can do whatever they want" mentality as apparently new generation kids love to be slaves of a higher power. Before the internet people had way more guts to actually care about how a company scams them over, now there is only sheeply acceptance and irrelevant ad hominem they use to stay being part of collective insanity lol. People still defend the BS idea of "it's okay when video games being released in an unplayable state for years because video game development is hard" when they mostly use Unreal Engine anymore. Not to mention even early PC video games weren't that buggy and if they had a bug it would be one of those hard to find ones as why video games are buggy anymore has nothing to do with technological advancement and "how complex a game is" so as they believe, it's all about how greedy companies are as because of their sense of success depends on how much a video game sold, not even if they did profit significantly. Of course companies cares how much money earn, but they don't actually care about how much profit they make anymore. They really expect to spend like $200 to develop a video game but the game wouldn't sell well if it had sold $5000. It has to at least sell 2 millions or else lol.
Then this indicates how video game companies ignores really good ideas that they believe it won't sell millions and the ideas that are too costly for them. It can explain why we don't see PS2-era's creative video games anymore as most new video games are bunch of copy-paste that's filled with whatever is generic just to ensure their "at least 2 millions sale" goal so it makes people research old video games just to play a significant video game because new video games are hardly a video game anymore, they are just rubbish empty programs that takes 150 GB space. I may seemed to bash new generation a lot but of course there are part of new generation kids who are not like this at all as they are even being interested in playing PS2 video games while their peers believe old video games are necessarily bad because they believe video games only became something after 2015 or something and they wouldn't play any game that at least didn't sell one million lol, however they have no idea older video games were released without any care to satisfy generic taste of people or being so fixed with "millions of sales" goal therefore there are tons of fun video games used whatever good ideas that you can hardly see after PS2-era and they are good games despite they hardly sold half of a million, after all how good a game is depends on you instead of how much a game sold and review scores.
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