Walking Simulators

[fake-kun]

I disagree, what makes some games recognised as being great and timeless was because you could always enjoy them when redoing it for the 10th time. Mario 64 and Doom are some examples among many.

But then again you've just dismissed almost every arcade and 8-bits era video game ever since they're made to be really short with replayability in mind which is probably not what you actually wanted to imply.

And once again not everyone would agree with your statement (which is an opinion despite the usage of the term "overrated" to make it seemingly objective).

Why are movies seen again, musics listened again and books read again but not video games?

The issue is that when a game is marketed to be hundreds of hours long but offers little to no variety in its gameplay it makes it less enticing than a short yet intense experience.

I don't know how to say it nicely, so I'll say it straight: someone expressing their opinion on the Internet is not an invitation to debate.

 

[Strategist's icon Strategist Strategist]

Replayability is overrated.

Absolutely. If you look at the statistics on how many players replay games, it will tell you that much. And that's before mentioning how many players actually finish the games they start. Those who replay games over and over are an extreme minority.

 

[Ikagura Ikagura]

I don't know how to say it nicely, so I'll say it straight: someone expressing their opinion on the Internet is not an invitation to debate.

Excuse me but you're saying something on a public forum so it's natural to have people agreeing or disagreeing with something said, it's one of the fundamental principles of freedom of speech (within the rules of the forums and as long as it's not discriminatory nor defamatory obviously). If I had an opinion but didn't want to debate about it wouldn't really say it publicly to make it easier.

I'd argue that saying "something is overrated" is not expressing an opinion but trying to state a fact. Maybe it's just me and my point of view in the way things are said but this is why I would've said something more like "I don't really care about replaying video games I like."

I don't aim to be confrontational or antagonising but it's just that when someone says something like a fact that I disagree with I'm trying to pose some counter-argument.

If you're actually younger than I thought then I'd present my apology and we could forget about it and no longer try any further.


Back to the subject: walking simulators should be more interactive with the environment beyond the main story. Like an optional area and actual game over states if things are done wrongly.

Absolutely. If you look at the statistics on how many players replay games, it will tell you that much. And that's before mentioning how many players actually finish the games they start. Those who replay games over and over are an extreme minority.

It depends of what kind of game as well.

I mean the entire thing about Zero Escape (especially the first game 9 Doors 9 Persons 9 Hours) is that

Spoiler: big story spoiler

You replay the game with the knowledge of your previous run, fast text for moment already done and you discover that it's a vision of a potential future from the far past by one of the characters that has psychic powers so they want to see your various deaths until they find the right combination to help her in her epoch. You have to get the coffin ending to be able to have a secret code that you'll have to use in a parallel route that is completely in the opposite of your main one to get to the true ending so you cannot finish the game the first time even with a guide or previous playthrough knowledge before starting the game for the first time.

 

[fake-kun]

Excuse me but you're saying something on a public forum so it's natural to have people agreeing or disagreeing with something said, it's one of the fundamental principles of freedom of speech (within the rules of the forums and as long as it's not discriminatory nor defamatory obviously). If I had an opinion but didn't want to debate about it wouldn't really say it publicly to make it easier.

I'd argue that saying "something is overrated" is not expressing an opinion but trying to state a fact. Maybe it's just me and my point of view in the way things are said but this is why I would've said something more like "I don't really care about replaying video games I like."

I don't aim to be confrontational or antagonising but it's just that when someone says something like a fact that I disagree with I'm trying to pose some counter-argument.

If you're actually younger than I thought then I'd present my apology and we could forget about it and no longer try any further.

IDK, I thought the fact that my post was three words long made it clear that it was a throwaway post that I had no interest in debating, but whatever, I don't really care.

 

[Tbest25]

Yumi Nikki it's the best kind of walking simulator to me

 

[Ikagura Ikagura]

And I find it interesting that Megaman having the choice of the levels right at the beginning in the classic games was also to allow a massive replay value (aside from the order made to make things easier but it's from trial and error) but you do you.

Let's agree to disagree about it and I should probably get to sleep instead of debating over a mere comment.

 

[LiberoVulpesLiberoVulpes's icon]

Now that i think about it, i suppose LSD Dream Emulator, Cosmology of Kyoto, and Eastern Mind are technically walking sims, i like those too.

 

[fake-kun]

And I find it interesting that Megaman having the choice of the levels right at the beginning in the classic games was also to allow a massive replay value (aside from the order made to make things easier but it's from trial and error) but you do you.

Let's agree to disagree about it and I should probably get to sleep instead of debating over a mere comment.

I do like Mega Man games for their replayability, but they're an exception.

 

[Zerohour2k12]

Stanley Parable is funny, and that's about it.

Yeah, Narrator Guy was Cool.

 

[blackfrostbufu]

In terms of walking sims, I'd say that MiSide is a walking sim kinda deal, though it was pretty fun and interesting.

 

[Ikagura Ikagura]

I do like Mega Man games for their replayability, but they're an exception.

So you're making claims that counts only when you want.

Fine then, you won the debate, I won't go further.



I read that TV Tropes separates Visual Novels from Video Games.

 

[LiberoVulpesLiberoVulpes's icon]

Why not both? Memorable and replayable.

I mean sure, but that is very difficult to achieve Game Design wise, so its either or, or be very selective on memorable department. Not every Robot Master or Willy fight is memorable, for example.

I think I could even replay the Zero Escape games just for the puzzles even if I knew the story.

I think with puzzles it would be a bit too difficult, because you would probably have to forget the solutions, or for the puzzles themselves to have a certain amount of randomness to their solution (i am not familiar with Zero Escape, if it has random generated puzzles, ignore this), or to be so complex its impossible to memorize the set path.

 

[Ikagura Ikagura]

I mean sure, but that is very difficult to achieve Game Design wise, so its either or, or be very selective on memorable department. Not every Robot Master or Willy fight is memorable, for example.

Of course of course. But this is the bread and butter of old school platformers since they couldn't make the game long nor with a ton of side content.

It started getting more like a collectathon around Super Mario World, Yoshi's Island and Donkey Kong Country when they got more space in the cartridge so you would have more optional levels and collectibles to get.

You can have a nice memorable experience but if it's a game that you couldn't replay then the full price would be a bit too much imo.

At least offer a NG+ or have DLCs for the more recent games so you could be tempted to restart the game.

I think with puzzles it would be a bit too difficult, because you would probably have to forger the solutions, or for the puzzles themselves to have a certain amount of randomness to their solution (i am not familiar with Zero Escape, if it has random generated puzzles, ignore this).

I haven't replayed the Nonary Game since 2018 so these puzzles aren't that fresh in mind.

As for Portal I like to try new ways to solve the puzzles and some people can even try speedrunning the game.

Advanced maps for Portal 1 and player made puzzles for the sequel are what makes it more worthwhile.

I think Portal's greatest strength is the way it still has a proper story and many hidden elements to make it worth replaying to discover more stuff (like the camera shy challenge or trying to bypass some rooms).

Standards VNs having little to no branching paths is detrimental to them imo.

This is what makes Chunsoft's Sound Novel so interesting: they have many branches that even leads to funny bad endings so some people would love to collect every endings and bad endings just for completion.

 

[Tonberry]

I liked the idea of many of them, but never got around to playing many. I remember being very excited for Firewatch because it seemed like a neat concept (but I don't really remember what set it apart back in the day), but it took forever to release and once it came out I had sort of lost interest. Then a friend of mine played it and was really disappointed with the ending or whatever, which kind of made me forget about it even more.

I suppose Journey counts? You control it like a 3D platformer, but the obstacles and challenges are very simple so it's mostly just you going forward and taking in the sights, but I very much enjoyed it back when I played it a hundred years ago, mainly due to how pretty it was and how good the music was, so it was easy to feel engaged in the journey (hehe) without it being very deep or intricate from a mechanical point of view.
It wasn't challenging or particularly "exciting", but it was engaging and felt good to finish, and I suppose that's all a game needs to be sometimes.

I also really want to play Death Stranding, but I haven't gotten around to it yet.

 

[Yousef]

As a professional Walker, these Walking Simulators need to step up their game. A truly authentic Walking Sim would give them a run for their money. I can’t stand most of them. They’re sitting on a lot of potential.

 

[LiberoVulpesLiberoVulpes's icon]

Of course of course. But this is the bread and butter of old school platformers since they couldn't make the game long nor with a ton of side content.

Fair enough, i'd add that making them difficult ended up becoming another way in order for the player to want to replay them just for mastery sake or speedrunning (i don't consider this replayability per se, but for the sake of the point, i will forget for this paragraph).

It started getting more like a collectathon around Super Mario World, Yoshi's Island and Donkey Kong Country when they got more space in the cartridge so you would have more optional levels and collectibles to get.

Ah, we have a little miscommunication here, i consider replayability as how different one playthrough would be from another, not taking into account self-imposed challenges, or stuff like 100% the collectibles or side content, i see more as, how different your party or build or ending(s) is from 1 playthrough to another.

For example, i think Mega Man has high replayability solely on the fact of Robot Master order, but i don't think something like Ninja Gaiden or OG Mario has actually high replayability, outside of just wanting mastery over the game.

You can have a nice memorable experience but if it's a game that you couldn't replay then the full price would be a bit too much imo.

I agree, but nothing is stopping the player from replaying it if they want, i think that solely depends on the player, there are VNs i am willing to replay. But, if they buy the game, they should know what they are in for at least, i assume they are aware of replay value before purchase (if they care about it).

At least offer a NG+ or have DLCs for the more recent games so you could be tempted to restart the game.

I miss the days when Expansions were like a whole new game.

Standards VNs having little to no branching paths is detrimental to them imo.

To clarify, Standard VNs have choices that matter, not having branching paths or only "but thou must" kind of choices is called Kinetic Novel.

 

[ciro64]

Lmao just go outdoors and take a walk

 

[CureMofurun]

I was really into Yume Nikki when I was younger and while I don’t have much exposure to Yume Nikki fan games, they very much exist to this day and there is even some cool stuff like that neat Yume Nikki Online Project. LSD Dream Emulator is also another classic that fits the bill and I really enjoyed it back in the day.

Exploration is always one of the most fun things about games for me, so a genre that is all about raw exploration has its charm, especially when the landscapes are out of this world, as you see in many of these high-effort Yume Nikki fan projects or even LSD Dream Emulator-inspired games.

I honestly don't think a walking simulator is much different than enjoying any piece of art out there, and you also have a nice bonus of being able to somewhat interact with it and really focus on individual details that you enjoy more personally. I think its neat.

 

[Ikagura Ikagura]

but i don't think something like Ninja Gaiden or OG Mario has actually high replayability, outside of just wanting mastery over the game.

The warp zones were made for subsequent playthrough in mind in Super Mario Bros.

In fact, Super Mario Bros changed gaming in the way that differentiates from the usual, fixed screen, arcade game where barely anything changes from one level to another. They introduced secret levels (the warp pipes and the warp zones) and they introduced thematic levels from a world to another or the level type like athletic and water levels.

When kids played the game on their Famicom (then on the NES) they discovered a world that seemed to have more life beyond the game screen, an actual kingdom with creatures instead of, just a mountain in Ice Climbers or a field in Balloon Fight with an actual blue sky instead of just having a void black background.

Super Mario Bros ended up being one of the most replayable game of its era (followed by 64 for 3D games).

I agree, but nothing is stopping the player from replaying it if they want, i think that solely depends on the player, there are VNs i am willing to replay. But, if they buy the game, they should know what they are in for at least, i assume they are aware of replay value before purchase (if they care about it).

Then I'd just watch a longplay on Youtube?

I've tried the Stein;Gate VN but ended up watching the anime instead.

I miss the days when Expansions were like a whole new game.

I honestly love post-game modes and areas (like one route opening after finishing the game once).

To clarify, Standard VNs have choices that matter, not having branching paths or only "but thou must" kind of choices is called Kinetic Novel.

I see. Then I got too many kinetic ones and they're just glorified PDF with a nice background than a video game per se.

 

[cola?]

I've tried the Stein;Gate VN but ended up watching the anime instead.

i haven't played halo because i watched the show and it's not very good