The state of the gaming industry and scalpers

[PlusK1n]

Been thinking about scalpers recently, and the exorbitant prices they place on titles which they seem to hold ransom.

Part of me thinks that this is an access issues and this is why other services to allow access exist.

But then the financier will argue that garnering demand for said product can act as a positive to spur investment towards a port / re-release / remaster.

But then how is this gaged?

We just have to look at the streaming landscape of PSN and Game pass to see how poorly things are going.

Tell me your thoughts on this, and what your solution would be?

 

[Strategist's iconStrategist]

I saw a post on reddit that exemplified how horrid the state of game collecting is. I remember 10 years ago when I could buy PS1 games on Ebay for reasonable prices, but now people are trying to rip each other off based on some ridiculous notion of collector value or scarcity.

Best example is the crappy Zelda CDi games being sold for 300 dollars. Does anyone believe the cultural or entertainment value of these games to be commensurate with that price? A rare piece of turd is still a turd.

 

[MasterEn]

scalpers will always exist. there isn't really anything that can be done about it. just like with bootlegs and knockoffs. ever eternal in presence. the best bet is to ignore them or report them.

 

[PlusK1n]

I saw a post on reddit that exemplified how horrid the state of game collecting is. I remember 10 years ago when I could buy PS1 games on Ebay for reasonable prices, but now people are trying to rip each other off based on some ridiculous notion of collector value or scarcity.

View attachment 39474

Indeed, it is insane, and some of the garage sales i have been too recently have caught on to the madness.

 

[_oBSOLEte_]

I think this all stems from over-advertisement and hype culture. I have no solution for it, and maybe it doesn't need one. People can spend their money how they see fit. I think it's all slop, but one man's garbage can be another man's treasure.

 

[AnonymousCookieMonster]

There's probably several ways to fight scalpers. If accounts have large orders for consoles/games then they should be put at the bottom of the list for shipping said titles. Same for known scalpers. That or give them the first batch since they are the most likely to have issues and if they resell and have to refund later they are stuck with hardware.

Second have enough of said titles that scalpers are wasting their money. So say have 10-20 million Playstations available at launch.

For games, when you sell out push another batch out. Pressing discs and in bulk is something like 10,000 at a time, so making more shouldn't be hard, more than that you just put a 3 week shipping note which gives time for said discs to be pressed, and then sent out to the warehouse where they can then be distributed to orders so a slight delay vs letting them worry about scalpers.

Finally... Once scalpers several times in a row find they scalp something and they can't resell it because there's abundant supply, they will sell at a loss to get rid of stock, at which point the producers slow down probably to half speed and then produce as they need.

 

[TheDuke_11037]

I'm curious to who's actually buying these games for such high prices. With all the shit you can do with modding console and emulation, being able to play these games easily. Is it really worth it??

 

[MasterEn]

There's probably several ways to fight scalpers. If accounts have large orders for consoles/games then they should be put at the bottom of the list for shipping said titles. Same for known scalpers. That or give them the first batch since they are the most likely to have issues and if they resell and have to refund later they are stuck with hardware.

Second have enough of said titles that scalpers are wasting their money. So say have 10-20 million Playstations available at launch.

For games, when you sell out push another batch out. Pressing discs and in bulk is something like 10,000 at a time, so making more shouldn't be hard, more than that you just put a 3 week shipping note which gives time for said discs to be pressed, and then sent out to the warehouse where they can then be distributed to orders so a slight delay vs letting them worry about scalpers.

Finally... Once scalpers several times in a row find they scalp something and they can't resell it because there's abundant supply, they will sell at a loss to get rid of stock, at which point the producers slow down probably to half speed and then produce as they need.

i do recall hearing about a game system [can't remember which one] that a lot of scalpers bought, and then they were stuck with all of the surplus and had to sell it for super cheap just to get rid of it.

 

[PlusK1n]

scalpers will always exist. there isn't really anything that can be done about it. just like with bootlegs and knockoffs. ever eternal in presence. the best bet is to ignore them or report them.

The trouble is that there are companies to stop bootlegging, piracy and even people owning their libraries in perpetuity. It has become an industry.

More needs to be done to keep ideas alive, to keep history alive. The problem is that history does not make them enough money, and they will only seek financial growth.

Post automatically merged: Sunday at 5:47 PM

I'm curious to who's actually buying these games for such high prices. With all the shit you can do with modding console and emulation, being able to play these games easily. Is it really worth it??

Ritch collectors, whom are looking for equity to invest their money in, as they wish to maintain value, which the banks will not do.

So it is housing property (meaning people like us cannot afford to live in it).

Games, meaning we cannot afford to buy old stuff.

And the cycle of investment and maintenance of value continues..

 

[AnonymousCookieMonster]

i do recall hearing about a game system [can't remember which one] that a lot of scalpers bought, and then they were stuck with all of the surplus and had to sell it for super cheap just to get rid of it.

In china apparently the new trifold phone Mate 80 or something scalpers are finding their investments sucked...

But yeah other consoles have had that same problem, don't remember which ones. Maybe it was the PS4 because no one could get it in over a year so they just lost interest, or the Wii-U where literally everyone was confused and didn't care.

I wish people would collectively just refuse scalpers, and then they would die off.

 

[Crabulon]

I don't appreciate scalping, but playing devil's advocate, if you have the funds to bulk purchase a sought after item and people are willing to pay a premium for it, then why wouldn't you. And it also proves that people's collections are actually worth something, beyond their sentimental value.

 

[PlusK1n]

There's probably several ways to fight scalpers. If accounts have large orders for consoles/games then they should be put at the bottom of the list for shipping said titles. Same for known scalpers. That or give them the first batch since they are the most likely to have issues and if they resell and have to refund later they are stuck with hardware.

Second have enough of said titles that scalpers are wasting their money. So say have 10-20 million Playstations available at launch.

For games, when you sell out push another batch out. Pressing discs and in bulk is something like 10,000 at a time, so making more shouldn't be hard, more than that you just put a 3 week shipping note which gives time for said discs to be pressed, and then sent out to the warehouse where they can then be distributed to orders so a slight delay vs letting them worry about scalpers.

Finally... Once scalpers several times in a row find they scalp something and they can't resell it because there's abundant supply, they will sell at a loss to get rid of stock, at which point the producers slow down probably to half speed and then produce as they need.

This is a good idea!

I also want some ways to fight intellectual property ownership also. May be force them to pay a feee every 20 years if they are not using it, and after 30years it goes to public auction or something.

 

[MasterEn]

The trouble is that there are companies to stop bootlegging, piracy and even people owning their libraries in perpetuity. It has become an industry.

More needs to be done to keep ideas alive, to keep history alive. The problem is that history does not make them enough money, and they will only seek financial growth.

true, and you would think that they would rerelease those properties to make a quick bit of cash, but they don't. i think one of the reasons has to do with copyright issues. i don't think nintendo, sony and microsoft hold all of the rights with a game if it is primarily made by another company. otherwise, there would be more than 20 nes games on the switch online service.

Post automatically merged: Sunday at 5:50 PM

This is a good idea!

I also want some ways to fight intellectual property ownership also. May be force them to pay a feee every 20 years if they are not using it, and after 30years it goes to public auction or something.

it used to be that after 30 years, any published work would be public domain. but disney interfered with that and now it would take a century and a quarter for anything made today to become public domain.

 

[_oBSOLEte_]

Retro games is a bubble. In twenty years when kids, who only ever played Fortnite, have grown and they're the one making money, all those cartridges with barely functioning ROMs will go right back to the trash bin.

 

[MasterEn]

In china apparently the new trifold phone Mate 80 or something scalpers are finding their investments sucked...

But yeah other consoles have had that same problem, don't remember which ones. Maybe it was the PS4 because no one could get it in over a year so they just lost interest, or the Wii-U where literally everyone was confused and didn't care.

I wish people would collectively just refuse scalpers, and then they would die off.

i think it was the ps4. scalpers bought them up, waited just a bit too long to sell them all, and then there was a massive surplus of the system, thus dropping the price.

 

[AnonymousCookieMonster]

I also want some ways to fight intellectual property ownership also. May be force them to pay a fee every 20 years if they are not using it, and after 30years it goes to public auction or something.

Copyright just needs to be heavily reduced. 10 years, maybe 20. 90% of profits are generated in the first month generally, and books and discs are out of print within 4 years and all other copies are just waiting in warehouses.

Also Software patents need to die die die.

 

[PlusK1n]

I don't appreciate scalping, but playing devil's advocate, if you have the funds to bulk purchase a sought after item and people are willing to pay a premium for it, then why wouldn't you. And it also proves that people's collections are actually worth something, beyond their sentimental value.

This is the supply and demand argument, and i agree with it to some sense.

The problem, what are we talking about? The art of the item?

The experience of this stuff can be studied on many levels, and is in danger of being lost, and that is a dang shame.

All that was learnt from good game design, good story telling, good world building.

All being thrown to the way side for the addictive predatory gaming of today, as one makes "more" money then the other.

But one is more sustainable then the other.. And i would argue that the older days of gaming fed a more stable industry, and we are now in a hell space of addictive ideals and culture which is in danger of becoming a shadow of what it used to be.

Gaming for me used to inspire, used to help relax you after a hard day.

Now?

Play the wrong thing and get spyed on and profiled, and prayed on to squeeze as much out of you as possible.

Post automatically merged: Sunday at 5:53 PM

Copyright just needs to be heavily reduced. 10 years, maybe 20. 90% of profits are generated in the first month generally, and books and discs are out of print within 4 years and all other copies are just waiting in warehouses.

Also Software patents need to die die die.

You are a person after my own heart!

Post automatically merged: Sunday at 5:55 PM

Retro games is a bubble. In twenty years when kids, who only ever played Fortnite, have grown and they're the one making money, all those cartridges with barely functioning ROMs will go right back to the trash bin.

This is why we need to save them. As that work, that data needs to be preserved..

 

[Strategist's iconStrategist]

Scalping isn't supply/demand. It is artificially creating scarcity due to a limited time increase in demand. Once people start getting smarter and learn not to give into the ransom note like behavior of the scalpers, they will start losing money.

 

[AnonymousCookieMonster]

From what i see, corporations quickly degrade after the founders die or sell the company off. And companies with a stockpile of IP's get lazy complacent and think they can just keep re-releasing the same things over and over again, either as remasters, remakes, licensing out, or thinking the name is strong enough they can throw out slop and make money.

More recently the idea of making always-online games where you sell skins and loot boxes (CSGO being the culprit to starting this BS), offering little content and selling digital non-items thinking there's infinite money.

After a certain point the companies just collapse, slurped up by a bigger company and the cycle continues.

 

[RanmyakuIchi's iconRanmyakuIchi]

The prices of retro games ballooning out of control is largely what pushed me into the arms of places like CDR/RGT, so that's an indirect positive of sorts. I deeply miss the days of going to a store and browsing retro games for cheap however, when the priciest, rarest game still wouldn't be TOO extravagantly priced.

 

[_oBSOLEte_]

This is why we need to save them. As that work, that data needs to be preserved..

I've already supported The Repo on Ko-Fi and Internet Archive. Other than torrenting ROMS untill the end of days I cant see what options are left.

 

[PlusK1n]

Scalping isn't supply/demand. It is artificially creating scarcity due to a limited time increase in demand. Once people start getting smarter and learn not to give into the ransom note like behavior of the scalpers, they will start losing money.

I hope this happens sooner rather then later.

The trouble is they have indoctrinated children growing up in the last 20 years with addictive habbets.

Get them while they are young, said by bad actors, advertisers, teachers and many others, as children can be programmed, which is why primary and secondary socialization is so important.

So now we have increased numbers of people who cannot switch off, suffering OCD due to the inability to switch off with current tech.

The tech is constantly watching, and with Youtube looking to give adds of up to 1 hour, it makes this even more of a problem.

In our house we switch things off at night, only my network is active, and only i am allowed to continue work, but that is because i work through the night, and then handle family stuff in the morning before i sleep.

No one goes to bed streaming, no one plays these predatory games.

This is one of many reasons i have a drive to protect what once was, as the retro gaming in my view (no offense to others, and i apologies if some may be, not my intent), and older teach was far far healthier, as we where allowed to switch off.

 

[Gorse]

I'm curious to who's actually buying these games for such high prices.

I've never known anyone to buy a massively-inflated game, but I absolutely have known people to buy scalped consoles because they want them as close to launch as possible. I had a friend who was scammed $600 for a supposedly-scalped Switch, and another who paid $300 over retail for a launch PS5 during the pandemic.

I like to think I'm smarter than that, but sometimes I'll see a New 3DS XL on eBay, and my mind will start to drift...

 

[AnonymousCookieMonster]

You are a person after my own heart!

Maybe, i'm just looking at it all logically.

Software should fall under copyright, not patents. Locking generic ideas like 'being able to play a mini-game during a loading screen' and the more recent patents from N and WB trying to lock out others from using them, or attack others for doing a better job than you. It's like the pharmaceutical companies pushing for much much much higher regulations, which makes new startups too expensive to be able to get off the ground, keeping a monopoly and removing the ladder that let them succeed.

Patents should be for a physical process to make or run something. Example being say a electric motor, which then gives a limited time for them to own the singular invention. Patents are also put on drugs.

Patents should also get increasingly more expensive to keep. Say filing a new patent is $1,000, then it's a thousand times more every 20 years. A company making billions on something may pay but once it's ubiquitous and not on high demand as it was in the beginning, going into public domain is good for everyone.

 

[PlusK1n]

I've never known anyone to buy a massive-inflated game, but I absolutely have known people to buy scalped consoles because they want it as close to launch as possible. I had a friend who was scammed $600 for a supposedly-scalped Switch, and another who paid $300 over retail for a launch PS5 during the pandemic.

I like to think I'm smarter than that, but sometimes I'll see a New 3DS XL on eBay, and my mind will start to drift...

It is psychological, and they know it which is why companies will pray on it more and more. And they are teaching AI to do it even more. So you can imagine where things are going.

Something has to be done soon, or we may be heading towards the cyberpunk future of high tech, and low quality of life!