The fate of the extended marketing of deep divers, lore creators and speed runners on gaming to come.

[Amag0k1]

We should have all seen what Captin N is doing with the Switch 2 and the terms of service there in, stating they can brick your console if they do not like what your doing with it.

So i am now asking how will this effect the gaming fandom echo system which arguably helps spread awareness and celebrate their product.

Looking at From games as a big example, which have deep lore, amazing game play and are seen as some of the best out there in recent history as they stuck to traditional game design.

I have to wonder about lore content creators which spread word of Froms works at a very nuanced and deep levels. Often celebrating it and this imho has arguably pushed the games to a higher level of awareness and enjoyment in the public, and fandom.

But i am wondering about the way they found some of the facts,beyond simple game play. Often relying on modding and mining data, analyzing what the artist or author as a whole are tring to communicate, and just admiring the work that went in to the product.

Would this practice continue to be acceptable if a company can brick your console for trying?

I am thinking of the likes of:

Zuli the Witch

Vatividia

and many others,

I know for me, this was one of the factors to revisit Demons souls after i cleared it a few times. With the same being said for Dark souls 2 and heck even blood borne, just to play and find some of the things they where talking about, and even get involved in some way towards lore building.

With that said, would this continue to be possible? And how would this effect the brand like From with the coming of the Dusck Bloods? (although dusk bloods is aparently going to have asimular format to fortnight being a battle game, so could this already be the death of traditional From games).

How will this effect and other Indi itles such as hollow knight who rely on content creators to help enrich the titles experience?

I am also wondering what will also happen to the speed running community when the service industry idea takes effect, as they also had an impact on the sale of some games.

I think if this goes bad and no one can deep dive, celibrate the game as they have or even speed run, they will be limiting awareness and exposure of their product beyond the manotiny of simple adds.

Will they now be blocked if they try, hainmg their investment bricked, and at worse have a worse human credit rating?

Ultimatly i see this stagnating and limiting awareness and exposure of their product and as a result will make this more generic.

What do you guys think?

Do you like the lore of souls like games?

Have you watched some of these channels?

Do you enjoy speed running?

Feel free to chime in on anything else which could be effected by this.

I would like to know your thoughts on this.

 

[valosagutas]

We should have all seen what Captin N is doing with the Switch 2 and the terms of service there in, stating they can brick your console if they do not like what your doing with it.

I don't care about Switch so I don't follow the news but it seems they thought of way more severe action that what Microsoft did about XBOX 360.

So i am now asking how will this effect the gaming fandom echo system which arguably helps spread awareness and celebrate their product.

They can physically find a way to bypass it via code and/or physically.

The modchip logic, for example, works via data of the game being send to the "main road" of the motherboard in a specific way by creating a shortcut. The most simple example is using cables that connect different regions of the motherboard. Thus the path of the data changed as it skips some part of the road, often starting from the beginning as it directly "jump" to the intended place in the road, and then the data goes through the rest of the console. This is how pirated games can work.

Or, the whole operation system of the video game console can be blocked and replaced with a chip that has a custom pirate software that can enable piracy.

However, if Nintendo don't care to reduce the cost about it and wanna invest in step-by-step "something is wrong" checks at the hardware level like imagine there are triggers in the CPU and GPU then it would be really hard to bypass and "work your way around".

Possibly a good anti-piracy measurement would be making a video game console online-only and it ask you to connect to internet to continue playing on it, something like how Denuvo works. When every time it's connected to the internet it debugs its system to check "every thing is how it should be" by collecting data from lots of part of the hardware to check if it's a "valid video game console" via its server before deciding if you are allowed to play or not and when "if not" they brick you console lol.

But i am wondering about the way they found some of the facts,beyond simple game play. Often relying on modding and mining data, analyzing what the artist or author as a whole are tring to communicate, and just admiring the work that went in to the product.

Would this practice continue to be acceptable if a company can brick your console for trying?

A video game can be analysed without the video game console that it's intended to run on. Only when you wanna apply mod and play it you would either need an emulator and a broken console. Console video game modding and piracy were always hand-to-hand.

Anti-piracy measurements prevent having fun with a modded game so it would be great if video game console companies found a middle ground. Mods could be tied to an upload system that the quality of control team analyses the mod and ensures it cannot be used to harm the system and/or allow piracy in some way, something like what Bethesda does. But then it's a matter of whether they would care about it to save budget for such a cost. "Would Nintendo care to hire Indians and make them work remotely?" is the question that may not have a feasible answer for Nintendo lol.

People sometimes break their console just to play modded game because some think the original game is useless without modding. Modding is very important for video game industry but all they think is "we don't want you to analyze our codes and make a change" lol. This is also why people may wanna skip buying a console game just because they can play the modded version of the game via emulator.

In the end no one will care about what you want if you don't allow them to get what they want. Lock a kid in the house and if the kid want he can even demolish the whole building to get out!!! Customers don't have to care about what a company want lol. When people buy a product they wanna use it in any way they want. Long story short Nintendo's terrorist acts and helicopter parenting behavior will be their doom if they won't get their BS together lol.

As for speedrunners, speedrunners never dies!! lol

As for FromSoftware games, IDK I don't care about their games.

 

[deh]

Nintendo can do whatever they want whether you like it or not If you don't like what Nintendo does then just don't buy their devices or you follow Nintendo's rules and that's it.

 

[Amag0k1]

Nintendo can do whatever they want whether you like it or not If you don't like what Nintendo does then just don't buy their devices or you follow Nintendo's rules and that's it.

Already doing it, the point of the article is to analyses the effect on the market, and reach-ability of games such a From Software games, with out the ways that the lore and deep dive was achieved.

I am probably not communicating this effectively, and i am sorry about that.

But TLDR, if From games where word of mouth to start (Demon souls 2009), and arguably continued to be for along time historically, related to these lore changeless and play though by streamers, and how they accessed the content at a deeper level to analyses the lore and design.

Then what happens if the company bricks the console and black lists the person for doing such things, and how they found the lore beyond playing?

Where is the world of mouth?

Where is the deep dive in lore?

Where is the celebration of the content?

As with out these channels, would the games have succeed on brand name alone? As i would argue, the brand is only as good as the content. But companies continue to feel their brand and reputation is what matters, but if you poo poo it, then that is what the reputation will be,.,........ pooo.

I hope that it clearer, beyond the generalization of "if you do not like it, do not buy it", as i would rather look at the problem, and have people talk about it to work it and potentially find a way forward.

Sorry if that makes some uncomfortable, just let me know and i will stop.

Also the line of "Nintendo can do whatever they want whether you like it or not If you don't like what Nintendo does then just don't buy their devices or you follow Nintendo's rules and that's it." is worrying and representative of the defeatist consumer.

If you accept this, where do you draw the line?

Spying on you when your gaming?

Theft of your personal data as a result of a data breach, which they have no invested interest in protecting as your agreed to hold them harmless?
Theft of your IP as Ai is manning your personal data?

What as a consumer will make you care more about how your treated by the company?

Post automatically merged: Monday at 6:07 PM

I don't care about Switch so I don't follow the news but it seems they thought of way more severe action that what Microsoft did about XBOX 360.


They can physically find a way to bypass it via code and/or physically.

The modchip logic, for example, works via data of the game being send to the "main road" of the motherboard in a specific way by creating a shortcut. The most simple example is using cables that connect different regions of the motherboard. Thus the path of the data changed as it skips some part of the road, often starting from the beginning as it directly "jump" to the intended place in the road, and then the data goes through the rest of the console. This is how pirated games can work.

Or, the whole operation system of the video game console can be blocked and replaced with a chip that has a custom pirate software that can enable piracy.

However, if Nintendo don't care to reduce the cost about it and wanna invest in step-by-step "something is wrong" checks at the hardware level like imagine there are triggers in the CPU and GPU then it would be really hard to bypass and "work your way around".

Possibly a good anti-piracy measurement would be making a video game console online-only and it ask you to connect to internet to continue playing on it, something like how Denuvo works. When every time it's connected to the internet it debugs its system to check "every thing is how it should be" by collecting data from lots of part of the hardware to check if it's a "valid video game console" via its server before deciding if you are allowed to play or not and when "if not" they brick you console lol.

A video game can be analysed without the video game console that it's intended to run on. Only when you wanna apply mod and play it you would either need an emulator and a broken console. Console video game modding and piracy were always hand-to-hand.

Anti-piracy measurements prevent having fun with a modded game so it would be great if video game console companies found a middle ground. Mods could be tied to an upload system that the quality of control team analyses the mod and ensures it cannot be used to harm the system and/or allow piracy in some way, something like what Bethesda does. But then it's a matter of whether they would care about it to save budget for such a cost. "Would Nintendo care to hire Indians and make them work remotely?" is the question that may not have a feasible answer for Nintendo lol.

People sometimes break their console just to play modded game because some think the original game is useless without modding. Modding is very important for video game industry but all they think is "we don't want you to analyze our codes and make a change" lol. This is also why people may wanna skip buying a console game just because they can play the modded version of the game via emulator.

In the end no one will care about what you want if you don't allow them to get what they want. Lock a kid in the house and if the kid want he can even demolish the whole building to get out!!! Customers don't have to care about what a company want lol. When people buy a product they wanna use it in any way they want. Long story short Nintendo's terrorist acts and helicopter parenting behavior will be their doom if they won't get their BS together lol.

As for speedrunners, speedrunners never dies!! lol

As for FromSoftware games, IDK I don't care about their games.

Fare points, and i agree with you for the most part. I am also familiar with probing contacts, and analysis of serial like data, which i think is what you mean.

But looking at the switch 2, it would be a gamble to try initially, and a massive money sink whole, with the console potentially bricked if it reports it has been opened. Remember, always on service infrastructure.

I will not go in to detail of the methodology here, as it would not be appropriate for this forum. But a lot of this is trial and error to start, and the only ones with invested interest to spend towards that are bad actors, rather then modders.

So like with the ps4 before and the like, unless there are people willing to spend and allow the console to be bricked, we will not see much in terms of data mining for a good while, purhaps even years.

 

[valosagutas]

Nintendo can do whatever they want whether you like it or not If you don't like what Nintendo does then just don't buy their devices or you follow Nintendo's rules and that's it.

Yes, only then Nintendo can care about what you want when shareholders start to draw their katanas!!! lol

If Nintendo don't want your money then they can just go bankrupt and running a maid cafe in Akihabara called "Nin-Hen-Do" all we would care lollolol.

 

[Sir Auriel of Lionel]

And we all have to accept it as the normies and normie parents will buy it without question to the ethics or what they sign up for until they find themselves bricked due to errors of the system not matching to online service standard by either a bug or an update ignored or the games they "own" missing from their library and store with only proof of purchase on their account's summary to begin to care about licensing and what ownership really means. Nintendo is hoping on this and will bank on this and will ride it out with no controversy or consequence or crash while we archivists just throw up out hands in disbelief after knowing months ahead.

 

[Amag0k1]

And we all have to accept it as the normies and normie parents will buy it without question to the ethics or what they sign up for until they find themselves bricked due to errors of the system not matching to online service standard by either a bug or an update ignored or the games they "own" missing from their library and store with only proof of purchase on their account's summary to begin to care about licensing and what ownership really means. Nintendo is hoping on this and will bank on this and will ride it out with no controversy or consequence or crash while we archivists just throw up out hands in disbelief after knowing months ahead.

100% on point, and i agree until enough people eat it, things will not change. But while they brace for impact, i still think it is important that others come up with solutions, so that thee is an alternative that can celibated and wake up to, and continue the hobble.

To me, gaming saved my life many times, and gave me an outlet to release negativities when they happened.

When i had a super hard day at work, gaming was there to help me switch off and focus on a story.

When i was feeling low and unwell related to my health problems, gaming got me though treatment.

For me, my gaming is therapeutic, and should be celebrated for its positives and pointed out for it's negatives, and when nasty companies try to use it as an outlet towards exploitation, addiction and towards lack of actual consent as a result of mental gymnastic, acting like some other bad actors, then this is a problem.

The problem when things go wrong with companies, they will say the product is to blame, often a brand, rather then what they put in to it, not admitting the problem. You can put pos in to a shinny nice smelling box, but when you open it, your still looking at a pos, and the person who did not flush it, is to blame!

So in a capitalist society, if there is some one looking at the problem and come up with an alternative solution, which respects the creation for what it is, something to be enjoyed, which has artistic integrity of the design, the story, the game play, and just what is being communicated, providing experiences that add value to the person like, which Captin N did during the 80s crash, then they will potentially benefit from the failures of big tech which is incoming.



Might be a fantasy on my part.

 

[Sir Auriel of Lionel]

Always online DRM is still years away from dinosaur principled Nintendo if they still don't have a cart function on the eShop. But whose to say they won't try to enforce a DRM check every time the system comes online to verify or lock out said customer via system mandatory update every month? My Steamdeck nearly locked me out because I had no internet to connect to my account to verify it to grab an update because I forgot go switch to offline mode before shutting off. I learned better and I hope Steam fixed as even if people share their decks this shouldn't enforce a system update until the person can and seems to listen every now and again or allows people to work best around the system with no fault to them. Nintendo to never asks what players want or listen to problems. You just have to deal with them. And now they might punish you for fixing said problems.

Most you can hope for is an online archive with files pre-first day patch or on cartridge of games to preserve before working emulators hit the forums.

 

[Dakarus]

 

[Sir Auriel of Lionel]

100% on point, and i agree until enough people eat it, things will not change. But while they brace for impact, i still think it is important that others come up with solutions, so that thee is an alternative that can celibated and wake up to, and continue the hobble.

Well it's not the industry dying it's the giants starting to fall and maybe that could trigger a crash (mainly publishers), the indie scene is thriving and still is even if people hesitate into locking down onto a system or ditching consoles for PC and emulation. My Steamdeck I say was my best purchase of my adult years with plenty of life in it, and if I don't have new games to look forward to release there's literal years worth of backlog to hit and new genres to try beyond usual comforts.

 

[Amag0k1]

Give it time.

 

[nobitakun]

I am still thinking how Nintendo can do anything with my Switch 2 console if I just don't connect it to the net?

If I buy a Switch 2 for hacking it Nintendo won't ever even know that console exists. That's the point on hacking a device. Who is so dumb to hack something and then connect it to the dev's services? :O

 

[Amag0k1]

I am still thinking how Nintendo can do anything with my Switch 2 console if I just don't connect it to the net?

If I buy a Switch 2 for hacking it Nintendo won't ever even know that console exists. That's the point on hacking a device. Who is so dumb to hack something and then connect it to the dev's services? :O

Games have to always be downloaded. Although, i am interested in what the process to use it is off line is, and if the console will even work with out connecting it online. Will it require activation, registration and serialization?
If no then this could be a positive.

Let us see what happens once it is out and people have had a proper play about wit it.

 

[moonbits]

such a shame we won't be able to get a 2 hour deep lore video and how many bananas are in donkey kong bananza.

 

[Amag0k1]

such a shame we won't be able to get a 2 hour deep lore video and how many bananas are in donkey kong bananza.

No no no, it is all the bananas! you have to listen to the song again!

 

[nobitakun]

Games have to always be downloaded. Although, i am interested in what the process to use it is off line is, and if the console will even work with out connecting it online. Will it require activation, registration and serialization?
If no then this could be a positive.

Let us see what happens once it is out and people have had a proper play about wit it.

Games need to be downloaded for sure, but not through the console. I was talking about doing every single thing outside the reach of Nintendo. As long as the console is hacked (if ever can be hacked), nothing can stop you from loading any game, patch whatever you need and do reverse engineering as much as you can in order to bypass whatever mine Nintendo has placed on the ground. This is not something like taking down an emulator or two, this is something like going to every home of every person who bought a Switch 2 with hacking skills and asking politely "don't do that please". Even if they have bounty program, it does not matter how much money they give away, eventually that information will be leaked on internet.