The "Edgelord" Protagonist

[ciro64]

not at all. im tired of writers feeling so self conscious that they hide behind irony. not every character has to practically wink at the camera like theyre embarrassed to exist let them be genuine in their melodrama let them monologue about the futility of existence without a knowing smirk. the edgelord is at its best when the author isnt afraid of committing to the sincerity theres something more engaging about a character who you can tell is genuinely intense and has some sort of believable edgy thought process, than one who just turns into a performance for the audience to laugh about how silly it is to take things seriously

I think they were talking about the non-self aware kind of ridiculous edgy, and Shadow is pretty much the embodiment of that.

From saying stuff like "Where's that DAMN fourth Chaos Emerald!?" and "This is like taking candy from a baby. Which is fine by me!" in edgy batman voice, to using real guns, riding a bike, killing stunning humans while allying with demoniac creatures in a gritty and dark apocalyptic city.

It's like the devs tried really hard to tick all the boxes so kids gets to feel cool and edgy while skirting the line of being a kids mascot game.

And that's why I love Shadow.


If we're gonna talk about about poking fun at edgy characters however, I've watched the Ty 3: Night of the Quinkan reveiw from Nitrorad and they do a good job at it, specially considering this was at a time where turning a colorful franchise into a edgy one was becoming an annoying trend.

 

[miguk]

"Nobody understands me or this dark power that's inside me."
*Proceeds to look at you with his red eyes, then flaunt his white hair that's covering one of his eyes, turn dramatically so his black trench coat flows in the wind, all while cradling his absurdly long sword.*

You ever notice how that partially describes all of them?
From Riku in Kingdom Hearts, to Protoman in Megaman. They all love their swords, white hair, long coats, red eyes, and "dark power" that they insist that no one could ever understand, because it's such a burden for some reason.

Honestly though, they are cool (what can I'm a 90s kid). Albeit very unoriginal.

Basically, the trope is just a wish fulfillment version of an angsty middle schooler or high school freshman. It's awkward puberty in a cape. And it sells well because the people they are aping are literally immature and quite often not good at critical reading, and thus can't see the ridiculousness of a grown adult (or even a super powered youth) acting like they do.

The original boys were edgy in the most childishly gruesome and silliest way possible.
Violence jack was around the time devil man and other stuff Go Nagai was adding sexually overtop wacky stuff in his manga which this is a good example.and then there’s this guy who is the true main character

The Boys was a terrible comic. I got about a few rape jokes in before giving up (which is not far, given how rapey the series is). If Garth Ennis is ever tried for any form of sexual assault, I will not be even slightly surprised.

I think people just like badass characters.

Obviously, sometimes it’s their relatability or their writing, but it’s all based on the rule of cool.

However, I remember recently the resurgence in Superman interest because people were tired of the same edgy circlejerk, which I think will happen again and again.

People get tired of moral heroes; they flock to edgelords; they get tired of those and flock back to moral heroes; they get tired of those—

I had an edgelord phase where all I listened to was shitty Brazilian funk or metal, watched those ‘Entrepreneur’ videos and idolised characters like Sasuke or Walter White or Tyler Durden before I got bored of it.

I like edgelords, but I also have a soft spot for normal heroes with a morally grey pattern.

That cycle isn't that long. We've only had edgelord superheroes since the 80s, with the 90s ones being poor imitations of the earlier ones. The backlash against that came pretty quick (Kingdom Come was from 1996), and only returned to edgelord status quo because of the influence of Hollywood directors who have a weird habit of failing upwards to the point of influencing the comics (Bryan Singer, Joss Whedon, Zack Snyder). That too eventually died off (Ultimate Marvel and DC New 52 are both rightfully dead) as the studios that own them realized the majority of the public doesn't actually want that trash (at least, not in the typical lazily written form).

 

[Evaccaneer Doom]

Vegeta, Sasuke, Kanda, Bakugo, Killua, Byakuya, Levi... All of these characters, and many more, embody some version of the "distant edgelord" trope. They're also all fan-favorites and many are easily the most popular in their respective series. Many of them end up having considerable character growth as they 'open up', but let's be honest... most of the time this happens long after their fandom exploded. Something about them just... captures people.

But how do you feel? Do you tend to flock towards these characters? What is it about them that people find so captivating?

View attachment 27947
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For me personally, they're usually pretty off-putting before they get that development, and a small few are honestly so bad about it that it almost hurts the series for me... but even those ones usually pay off eventually. Some even become favorites of mine.

Depends. You can do an edge lord right or wrong imo

Right:
-Shadow
-Zero (MMZ)
-Luca Blight
-Kefka
-Squall
-Laharl
-Junko (the Touhou one)
-Junko (the other one)
-every Ultrakill character
-Ragna the Bloodedge (ironically, the one with bloodedge in the name might actually be the best edge lord character of all time)
-Jack Cayman
-Neon Violet
-Sweetheart
-Yoshitaka Mine
-Zant

Spoiler: Purse Owner 4

-Adachi (can this even be considered a spoiler anymore, he's been memed to hell and back)

Wrong:
-that guy from Hatred
-Silver (Pokemon GSC)
-Mao (Disgaea 3)
-Shadow (Final Fantasy VI)
-Double (Mega Man X4)
-Yoko (SMT V Vengeance) (seriously she is so pessimistic and contrarian that she brings down even something as depressing as a Shin Megami Tensei game, if Sam from Danny Phantom were a video game character, she'd be named Yoko)
-Akira Nishikiyama (pre Yakuza 0)

 

[chufflord]

If we're gonna talk about about poking fun at edgy characters however, I've watched the Ty 3: Night of the Quinkan reveiw from Nitrorad and they do a good job at it, specially considering this was at a time where turning a colorful franchise into a edgy one was becoming an annoying trend.

The crimes of Jak against his fellow mascot platformer brethren will never be forgotten.

The Boys was a terrible comic. I got about a few rape jokes in before giving up (which is not far, given how rapey the series is). If Garth Ennis is ever tried for any form of sexual assault, I will not be even slightly surprised.

It's the same reason I couldn't really get into it either, it's just gross for the sake of being gross.

 

[Num]

I'm not saying that writing edgy characters is something to be embarrassed about. It's usually portrayed as some form of growth- this brooding person growing to open up to others around them and the like. Squall, Cloud, and Luke come to mind right away as characters that got some serious growth in their own stories- they mature. I just appreciate it when writers poke fun at the trope, because it definitely comes from a place of love, not self consciousness.

Like, who could hate someone like Dante from Devil May Cry, or write a character like that because they're insecure about the trope? That would be completely incomprehensible.

youre right in many cases it is portrayed as something to 'grow out' of which is already a critique of the mindset to begin with so addtionally poking fun at it through exaggeration and gleaming self awareness throughout is redundant and just reeks of being insecure. its like admitting up front that youre too aware of how people might perceive it so you turn it into a little joke for it to be safe just for people to easily digest it. but you shouldnt have to constantly reassure people that youre in on the joke. just commit.

i avoided the shadow example because you were making a general statement but dmc is a whole other beast and i think my grievances with dmc5 serves as a good example to this postmodernist mindset. it still likes the aesthetic it still indulges in it but theres this subtle undercurrent of detachment to it as if its play-acting as its old self rather than genuinely embodying it. its like someone sitting down with a child and playing toys with him. dmc5 has this feeling of "playing" a feeling of putting on a perfomance for the child to have his fun, theres that hint of indulging in the nostalgia of it but youre just not fully believing in it. dmc used to be a series that just didnt fucking care and gets enamored in the experience. its the difference between loving something vs remembering why you used to love it. theres nothing wrong with genuinely being edgy like you once were, i see a lot of writers lately just write it off as a simple "phase" theyre nostalgic for when its more than that. it was a genuine world view that you went through.

 

[Antilocal123]

Basically, the trope is just a wish fulfillment version of an angsty middle schooler or high school freshman. It's awkward puberty in a cape. And it sells well because the people they are aping are literally immature and quite often not good at critical reading, and thus can't see the ridiculousness of a grown adult (or even a super powered youth) acting like they do.


The Boys was a terrible comic. I got about a few rape jokes in before giving up (which is not far, given how rapey the series is). If Garth Ennis is ever tried for any form of sexual assault, I will not be even slightly surprised.


That cycle isn't that long. We've only had edgelord superheroes since the 80s, with the 90s ones being poor imitations of the earlier ones. The backlash against that came pretty quick (Kingdom Come was from 1996), and only returned to edgelord status quo because of the influence of Hollywood directors who have a weird habit of failing upwards to the point of influencing the comics (Bryan Singer, Joss Whedon, Zack Snyder). That too eventually died off (Ultimate Marvel and DC New 52 are both rightfully dead) as the studios that own them realized the majority of the public doesn't actually want that trash (at least, not in the typical lazily written form).

True, but yeah the Boys Comic was horrendous, it felt like Garth had a massive hate boner and just wanted to make a comic shitting on superheroes without deconstructing the genre.

It kinda reminds me of those fantasies I had in like Elementary where I wanted Cloud from FF to hurt my bullies lol

 

[RanmyakuIchi's iconRanmyakuIchi]

I'm personally a fan of the "Knight in Sour Armor" heroic jerkass take on it. The person on the hero team that's cynical, abrasive, and egocentric, but still has a strong sense of mortality when the chips are down. The super edgy dude who ends up being the biggest Ride-or-Die for the hero in the end.

 

[chufflord]

youre right in many cases it is portrayed as something to 'grow out' of which is already a critique of the mindset to begin with so addtionally poking fun at it through exaggeration and gleaming self awareness throughout is redundant and just reeks of being insecure. its like admitting up front that youre too aware of how people might perceive it so you turn it into a little joke for it to be safe just for people to easily digest it. but you shouldnt have to constantly reassure people that youre in on the joke. just commit.

i avoided the shadow example because you were making a general statement but dmc is a whole other beast and i think my grievances with dmc5 serves as a good example to this postmodernist mindset. it still likes the aesthetic it still indulges in it but theres this subtle undercurrent of detachment to it as if its play-acting as its old self rather than genuinely embodying it. its like someone sitting down with a child and playing toys with him. dmc5 has this feeling of "playing" a feeling of putting on a perfomance for the child to have his fun, theres that hint of indulging in the nostalgia of it but youre just not fully believing in it. dmc used to be a series that just didnt fucking care and gets enamored in the experience. its the difference between loving something vs remembering why you used to love it. theres nothing wrong with genuinely being edgy like you once were, i see a lot of writers lately just write it off as a simple "phase" theyre nostalgic for when its more than that. it was a genuine world view that you went through.

I should've clarified DMC3 in my original post as the game I had in my head- but to be honest I feel like it's still that same vibe in it's newer entries. It doesn't care if you think it's cringe or not and lets you get absorbed in it. Are the characters over the top? Yes, and it's also very sincere in what it puts forward regarding family conflict and whatnot, even if that message is portrayed with dudes in trench coats stabbing each other with oversized swords and turning into demons.

The best edgy characters are written by folks who can understand the mindset, and I think you can both thrive in it while also acknowledging that it'll come across as a bit silly to others at times. That's the opposite of insecurity to me.

 

[J.F.C]

Vegeta, Sasuke, Kanda, Bakugo, Killua, Byakuya, Levi... All of these characters, and many more, embody some version of the "distant edgelord" trope. They're also all fan-favorites and many are easily the most popular in their respective series. Many of them end up having considerable character growth as they 'open up', but let's be honest... most of the time this happens long after their fandom exploded. Something about them just... captures people.

But how do you feel? Do you tend to flock towards these characters? What is it about them that people find so captivating?

View attachment 27947
​

For me personally, they're usually pretty off-putting before they get that development, and a small few are honestly so bad about it that it almost hurts the series for me... but even those ones usually pay off eventually. Some even become favorites of mine.

How is Bejita a edgelord? He doesn't have anything edgy about him he's just an arrogant motherfucker.

 

[Bonkers225]

 

[beefbowl]

Seems like everyone forgot about my boy Alex Mercer. He's the epitome of edgelordiness in every way.

 

[Mr. Andersom]

 

[Deleted member 121503]

I love edgelord characters lol. Cid Kagenou from The Eminence In Shadow is the coolest character in all fiction period. There's this charm in super edgy characters you don't really get from others, like, sure, well-written deep characters are nice and all, but sometimes you just just feel like watching edgy characters doing edgy stuff.

 

[Octopus]

Depends if they're done well like numerous people here have already said. A big thing is also the context of the world/story/whatever around them; if they fit into it or if they don't. I laugh at Shadow the Hedgehog primarily because he looks so fundamentally out of place in Sonic that it feels like a purposeful joke, while someone like the Punisher or Vergil make sense in the context of what's around them so you can take them seriously.

The interesting thing about Batman is that he never crosses the line of being a true edgelord.

Doesn't kill, refuses to use guns, will stop what he's doing to help those in need, but most importantly: he might use fear or even his fists to interrogate criminals, but will always bring a lollipop in case he needs to interrogate children.

There's a quote from someone I can't remember the name of about that idea; "if you can't imagine your version of Batman comforting a child, then it's a bad version of Batman. It's just Punisher in a funny hat." Batman done right is that, too much edge and I think people lose what's supposed to be the point of the character.

 

[Ezri_Muldoon]

Having an edgelord discussion in the year of our Lord Shadows return to cultural prominence after bringing both his love for guns and motorbikes to the cinema amuses me.

That is all. Please continue.

 

[Ikagura]

Black Jack, while not being a fully-fledged "edgelord" by today's standard, was quite an antihero in a much more realistic manga for its time.

He's a surgeon without a doctorate that does expensive operations yet is a genius (but wouldn't hesitate to strike badly his antagonists if they're menacing him or Pinoko).

I think the term edgelord is hard to coin because not every antihero is one and not every edgelord are antiheroes either.

From Riku in Kingdom Hearts, to Protoman in Megaman. They all love their swords, white hair, long coats, red eyes, and "dark power" that they insist that no one could ever understand, because it's such a burden for some reason.

I think you've confused Protoman with Zero.

And, I don't know if it's entirely "edgelord", but I LOVE "too angry to die" characters:
Doomguy (Doom), Raphael (Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles), Shadow (Sonic), Kratos (old Kratos, from classic God Of War), Jacket (Hotline Miami), Kir Kanos (Star Wars), Darth Bane (Star Wars)

Raphael in The Last Ronin was quite great.

I think they were talking about the non-self aware kind of ridiculous edgy, and Shadow is pretty much the embodiment of that.

Shadow the Hedgehog completely flanderised the character when his behaviour in Heroes, the direct prequel, had nothing to do with that.

"Nobody understands me or this dark power that's inside me."
*Proceeds to look at you with his red eyes, then flaunt his white hair that's covering one of his eyes, turn dramatically so his black trench coat flows in the wind, all while cradling his absurdly long sword.*

Rock Howard has every codes of the edgelord yet isn't one.

It only shows when you do his father's super attack, Raging Storm, to the max power.

 

[J.B’s rabbit den]

Basically, the trope is just a wish fulfillment version of an angsty middle schooler or high school freshman. It's awkward puberty in a cape. And it sells well because the people they are aping are literally immature and quite often not good at critical reading, and thus can't see the ridiculousness of a grown adult (or even a super powered youth) acting like they do.


The Boys was a terrible comic. I got about a few rape jokes in before giving up (which is not far, given how rapey the series is). If Garth Ennis is ever tried for any form of sexual assault, I will not be even slightly surprised.


That cycle isn't that long. We've only had edgelord superheroes since the 80s, with the 90s ones being poor imitations of the earlier ones. The backlash against that came pretty quick (Kingdom Come was from 1996), and only returned to edgelord status quo because of the influence of Hollywood directors who have a weird habit of failing upwards to the point of influencing the comics (Bryan Singer, Joss Whedon, Zack Snyder). That too eventually died off (Ultimate Marvel and DC New 52 are both rightfully dead) as the studios that own them realized the majority of the public doesn't actually want that trash (at least, not in the typical lazily written form).

There’s literally even a professor X knock off made to throw shit at the original with his whole entire schtick being he’s a PDF.file…………….?

 

[Taukyrie]

Black Jack, while not being a fully-fledged "edgelord" by today's standard, was quite an antihero in a much more realistic manga for its time.

He's a surgeon without a doctorate that does expensive operations yet is a genius (but wouldn't hesitate to strike badly his antagonists if they're menacing him or Pinoko).
View attachment 28051

I think the term edgelord is hard to coin because not every antihero is one and not every edgelord are antiheroes either.

BLACK JACK MENTION LET'S GOOOOOO

But I do agree. I think there should be a clear separation between what an edgelord is and what an anti-hero is because they are two different things.

 

[miguk]

There’s literally even a professor X knock off made to throw shit at the original with his whole entire schtick being he’s a PDF.file…………….?

To be fair, Stan Lee did not do well writing the early issues of X-Men. Prof X was constantly lusting over Jean Grey in the early issues while trying to coach himself into hold back his feelings. The series as a whole was just a mess until the Claremont era.

That said, I doubt Ennis did a good job at the commentary, as he probably did worse than Cracked did. (Wouldn't surprise me if he found out about it from their articles.)

 

[NobodyHere]

Vegeta, Sasuke, Kanda, Bakugo, Killua, Byakuya, Levi... All of these characters, and many more, embody some version of the "distant edgelord" trope. They're also all fan-favorites and many are easily the most popular in their respective series. Many of them end up having considerable character growth as they 'open up', but let's be honest... most of the time this happens long after their fandom exploded. Something about them just... captures people.

But how do you feel? Do you tend to flock towards these characters? What is it about them that people find so captivating?​

Media has always had an obsession with the ‘bad boy’ the ‘I can fix him type’. A lot of the noise is/was due to it mainly being teenage girls expressing their love for these characters, I remember the fuss about Bakugo and Levi. I find it’s fun, it’s the ‘I’m not like other girls’ trope with a new coat of paint, which I find rather enjoyable; Has such a nostalgic feeling.

I bring forward Kei Nagai from Ajin. Love to bully this little shit

 

[Nidoking's iconNidoking]

View attachment 28012

Absolutely.

 

[Vetusomaru]

Vegeta, Sasuke,​

These aren't protagonists. They're friends/rivals of the protagonists.

 

[Nidoking's iconNidoking]

These aren't protagonists. They're friends/rivals of the protagonists.

They are protagonists, just not MAIN protagonists. They're still promoting the same ideals as the main character and ultimately on the main character's side in the grand scheme of things.

 

[Prism_Red]

Edgelords are fine if done right, as in there is a plausible reason or motivation that makes them edgy in the first place. Sasuke is a good example, you don't go around acting like Dora The Explorer after having your entire family massacred.
And as much as I like Hiei, he is a bad example, maybe he is just aloof to begin with but there is no reason for him to be brooding all the time.

How is Bejita a edgelord? He doesn't have anything edgy about him he's just an arrogant motherfucker.

Dude did you see his hair? Edges all over.

 

[miguk]

Edgelords are fine if done right, as in there is a plausible reason or motivation that makes them edgy in the first place.

Depends. If the reason for their behavior is well developed, then yes, they could potentially work well. But there's a fine line between well developed and contrived, and too many writers fail to get that right.

Likewise, anti-heroes can work if the story either gives strong, non-contrived, non-strawmanned justification for their actions; or, conversely, does not even try to justify their actions, but instead condemns them. Rorschach from Watchmen is a great example of both: the reasons for why he is the way he is are well explained without feeling forced, but at the same time, Moore tries to get the reader to understand that Rorschach is a horrifying person and should not be celebrated. (Unfortunately, many readers suck at critical thinking and missed the "this guy is horrible" part.)