Anime Subs Vs. Dubs: The Final Frontier

[DinoRexMax]

(Ironic I use and Naruto image for this, since Naruto is one of the earlier examples of a mainstream purist dub after Cowboy Bepop, after first being a sanitized 4kids-like dub for a season, remember "Rise, Ninja!"? Pepperidge farm remembers....)

I've seen enough of these "...but it's an Anime Dub" parodies to the point where they've seemingly lost all meaning. Twitter, being the cesspool that it is, is filled to the brim with 0 IQ takes, emboldened primarily by the fact that with the host of Funimation/Crunchyroll controversies making defending anything in the Dubbing/Localization industry nearly indefensible.

But localization is quite the difficult task (even when they aren't actively shooting themselves in the foot with asinine ideas). It's unenviable undertaking to try and transpose the concepts and ideas of one culture to another, while also working in the strict limitations of the medium they are given (translating a book is one thing, but Manga requires you to fit all your words into the speech balloons and Anime needs to match the original animation and mouth flaps, all of which is oriented around a language that is read vertically or spoken inverted and in syllables). And now, more than ever, it must feel like walking on landmines. Back in the days of Harmony Gold, with Cobra and Robotech, the internet was little more than isolated BBS servers. Now, with the World Wide Web proper, fans are becoming more familiar with the source than the creators at this point. You start dubbing something and it's already got a fanbase of 1000 people who are 100 episodes ahead of you and your crew.

But Dubs add a certain level of convenience and understanding you can't get from just reading subs, especially when reading a bunch of words on my TV takes my eyes away from the action. And purists are the biggest hypocrites without even knowing it. They can criticize the acting of Dub VAs all they want, because they're just playing ignorant to their lack of understanding of Japanese language and parlance. Of course English VAs sound worst to your ears, your able to pick out the idiosyncrasies due to speaking the same language, then pit it against Hollywood actors with billion dollar paycheque. How do you know Japanese VAs don't sound the exact same to a Japanese audience? How do you know what GOOD Japanese acting even sounds/looks like? You don't, and you're just filling in the gaps.

But like I said, Dubs havne't been really giving themselves a super great rep as of the past 5 or so years. Though, if I were to get into all of the reasons why, things'd get pretty politically heated, and I'd feel like we'd be crossing a line. And we're here to have fun.

So, what's the consensus around these parts? You like your Mangos and Animus with, or without Jelly Donuts and Hamburgers?

 

[Zerohour2k12]

I watch both, and dubs I'd sometimes prefer if the performance of the cast is solid but I go for subs first.

 

[DinoRexMax]

I'd like to shamelessly bump this thread, and make a side note on the career of one, Gary Chalk. Gary Chalk is a Canadian actor, who is best known for being the second most prevalent voice of Optimus Prime/Primal (second to Peter Cullen).

He's presents an interesting dichotomy in voice acting, since not only has he dubbed both Western and Eastern animation, he's also, like, a real actor. Like, live action and on TV and in movies and stuff. Nothing super major (since he's always typecast as a General or a Police Captain) but you'd Blink and you'll miss him in movies such as "The Predator" (mailman), "Freddy vs Jason" (police captain), "The Fly II" (security guard) and "Watchman" (general in Nixon's cabinet).

The point being, he's been around. Specifically, he's done enough acting on all sides of the fence to properly gauge his performance.

He's also pertinent to the discussion at hand, seeing how there was something of a controversy with his involvement in the dubbing of the Unicron Trilogy (Armada, Energon, Cybertron). Fans compared his performance from Beaster Wars/Beast Machines with early Armada, and in interviews he highlighted the difficulties of dubbing Anime when compared to just acting in homemade stuff (despite having the benefit a character who didn't have a mouth, something Dave Wittenberg actually took advantage of as Kaakshi).

It doesn't help that the Armada and Energon were pretty sloppy during localization, which shows when compared to Cybertron and the voice acting drastically improves.

So really, for VAs, dubbing normal cartoons is like pulling the limiters off, and I imagine Japanese VAs have just as much diffculty dubbing something like King of the Hill or Spongebob or something.

 

[TruxtonTatsujin TruxtonTatsujin]

I only watched the dub if it offers something unique. I've given up on the possibility of it matching the original, so at the very least I'd like it to be entertaining in it's own right.

 

[Scotty Scotty]

Can I be honest here? I'm sick of the "SUBS vs DUBS" debate—especially since both aren't always perfect; I've seen anime with poorly translated subtitles before (especially when comparing fansubs to official subtitles) and I've seen bad dubs before (mainly those early, low budget dubs from the 80s and 90s). Conversely, I've also seen plenty of great dubs—some of which I prefer over the original Japanese versions like Frieren, Ameku MD, My Deer Friend Nokotan, Dungeon People, Dragon Ball, Panty & Stocking, and Roshidere just to name a few.

At the end of the day, it is merely a matter of personal preference. Just watch the show in whatever language you want and don't criticize people who don't like to read subtitles and prefer to watch anime dubbed in their native tongue.

 

[DinoRexMax]

Fuck who ever uploaded this, he cuts off part of Ryo's comeback.

Devilman: The Birth is such a fucking gorgeous movie too, shame it couldn't have gotten the same treatment as the Vampire Hunter D: Bloodlust movie (which had significantly better acting, while also being just as well animated).

Post automatically merged: Today at 5:18 AM

I've seen anime with poorly translated subtitles before (especially when comparing fansubs to official subtitles) and I've seen bad dubs before (mainly those early, low budget dubs from the 80s and 90s).

What are you talking about, man. Fansubs are always perfect.

Also:

Can I be honest here? I'm sick of the "SUBS vs DUBS" debate.

Oops, sorry, man...

 

[TruxtonTatsujin TruxtonTatsujin]

Also it's true, I don't watch Chinese cartoons

 

[LiberoVulpesLiberoVulpes's icon]

Dubs are for kids and tourists, simple as.

 

[Stare best girl]

Xenosaga 3 spoilers

 

[Scotty Scotty]

Fuck who ever uploaded this, he cuts off part of Ryo's comeback.
View attachment 147838
Devilman: The Birth is such a fucking gorgeous movie too, shame it couldn't have gotten the same treatment as the Vampire Hunter D: Bloodlust movie (which had significantly better acting, while also being just as well animated).

Post automatically merged: Today at 5:18 AM

What are you talking about, man. Fansubs are always perfect.

Not exactly. Several months ago, I rewatched "Bocchi the Rock!" with the fansubs and in EP 2, they decided to translate the part where Nijika labels her sister as "Tsun-tsun-tsun-tsun-tsun-tsun-DERE" into "Prickly-prickly-prickly-prickly" (or something to that effect). Then, I checked the official Crunchyroll subtitles and, wouldn't you know it, they did the sensible thing and left it as "Tsun-tsun-tsun-tsun-tsun-DERE".

Another instance of bad fansubs that I can recall is from the first season of "Slime 300" during the scene when Azusa is fighting the Demon King. At one point in the fight, the Demon King comments on Azusa's atrociously high strength to which she replies "Well, I am level 99, after all"—and you can CLEARLY hear the VA (Aoi Yuuki) say "Kyuujuu-kyuu" (99). The fansubs, meanwhile, were completely inaccurate (I can't remember exactly what it said, but I'm remember it being something cringe). A few months later, I would rewatch the show again with Muse Asia's subs and, to my surprise, Azusa says "I am level 99, after all" (haven't checked Crunchyroll's subs yet).

Back when I rewatched S1 of "My Dress-up Darling" just as S2 was right around the corner, I watched it with the fansubs as I heard that they were pretty good. For whatever reason, the translator decided to use a bunch of cringeworthy slang for Marin—YES, I KNOW, SHE'S A GYARU, but it's especially egregious when I hear her VA utter a very simple phrase like "He's asleep" to "My man is out like a light"... during a confession scene... in the final episode... in the last minute or so.

Lastly, I recall the fansubs for "Spy × Family" translated Anya's "Waku Waku" (an onomatopoeia for excitment) into a simple "cool"...despite Crunchyroll leaving it in as "Waku Waku".

I really hate to break it to you, but bad fansubs DO exist.

Post automatically merged: Today at 6:07 AM

Oops, sorry, man...

No, no, you don't have to apologize. I was just giving MY thoughts. You're 100% free to have this debate.

 

[TruxtonTatsujin TruxtonTatsujin]

Xenosaga 3 spoilers

damn emulators

Honestly I'm just grateful if the thing I want to watch has a fansub at all. Means I don't have to try and translate it myself.

 

[bjork]

It's really a case by case thing.

 

[saturnsh2x2]

My take on this is a firm "it depends."

English dubs vary wildly in quality, but there are good ones out there, even as early as the 90s. I will say, I'm more likely to check out a dub if the series leans more into a western setting or elements, and will usually put on the original Japanese dub if the series takes place in Japan, but even then, that's not a hard-and-fast rule. If a dub is bad, just switch to the sub. There is something to be said for being able to focus on the animation without having to split attention between subtitles.

Of course, on the flip side, I've never understood subs being a barrier for people to enjoy a series, especially if it's the only way to experience something in your native language.

Either way, no matter which side you prefer, the most important thing is that you get into fights with people on the internet over it, because you will most definitely be able to convince the opposing side of their inherent ontological wrongness.

 

[Jayonnaise6105 Jayonnaise6105]

I don't really care which people choose, subs or dubs, as long as they're enjoying it how they'd prefer. I think I mostly watch Japanese dub with subs. If I'm used to the English dub cast, I'll go with the English dub. Like with Naruto, Dragon Ball, Persona etc.

I used to be more familiar with the English cast of One Piece, but I don't think they bother dubbing the games anymore, so I'd say I've become more used to the Japanese cast there.

Honestly I'm just grateful if the thing I want to watch has a fansub at all. Means I don't have to try and translate it myself.

Yeah, the more important thing is that there is a way to watch/play something in the first place. Still hanging for a fan sub translation for Season 4 of Onegai My Melody and it not being available in English bothers me a lot more than the subs vs dubs debate hehe

 

[VampireLord1024VampireLord1024's icon]

I also watch both but mostly prefer dubs more.

 

[DinoRexMax]

Xenosaga 3 spoilers

"That bastard! He's activated the emulators!"

Some corpo says that everytime one us logs into The Repo, I'm sure...

 

[Tonberry]

English isn't my first language anyways, so it just depends on what I think fits best in the moment.
I usually try to watch every TV series in the language it was made for (like watching Wakfu in French, for example) but then I tend to prefer Dragonball in English, and Asterix in Swedish, so for anime it's definitely a case-by-case thing usually, while still leaning towards Japanese most of the time when it comes to anime.
I watched Dungeon Meshi in English and loved it.

 

[X y b e r - S k u ll]

I just prefer to watch things in their original language, no matter what that may be. Anime is a Japanese medium, so therefore I'll watch it in Japanese. The films of Andrei Tarkovsky are in Russian, so I'll watch them in Russian etc. I know translation will never be truly 1:1 (No matter what way you're translating) and we're often at the mercy of translators hoping they can do their job properly (Though I guess that goes for dubs too), but I still just prefer it this way.

 

[Pseudo64]

"You motherfuckers have been doing SUB VS DUB debate for 30 fucking years now. 30 fucking years. Its time to stop." - Gendo Ikari, Dragon Ball Z