Saturn NiGHTS Thread

[Ikagura Ikagura]

The issue is: As a Saturn lover and an admitted Sega fanboy I'm tired of people saying this turd is like the best thing since sliced bread, there were so many better games on the Saturn. I actually couldn't last more than 3 minutes playing this (honestly I was ready to go at the title screen)...

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You know that people have their opinions right?

You have yours (and I respect it since it's entirely subjective) but if your only argument doesn't go further than "In this game there are rings you travel in, Superman 64 has rings you travel in, therefore it's the same game" then it's no better than a fallacy about correlation.

Furthermore why telling "as a Saturn lover and an admitted Sega fanboy"? What does that change about what you're saying?

Finally your personal experience may be bad but 3 minutes doesn't even represent the entire game besides doing some paraloops in the first level's first route. It's like dropping Mario 64 right after entering the castle or even doing one level in Crash Bandicoot.

 

[trickybus]

All I want to know is WHY? all you do is fly through rings like Superman 64

Bro, all you do is go into threads and shit on the game being discussed. Are you okay? Do you need a hug?

Post automatically merged: Jun 20, 2025

Anywho, I wanted to link the NiGHTS storybook because I love the art style and it provides some backstory to how NiGHTS ended up in his prison:

NiGHTS Storybook ENGLISH « NiGHTS into Dreams .Com

 

[Ikagura Ikagura]

Bro, all you do is go into threads and shit on the game being discussed. Are you okay? Do you need a hug?

Maybe that'd be better to ignore them because they don't seem to be interested in actually debating.

I mean yeah, the biggest flaws about the game is the shortness and how Eliot's and Claris' gameplay before merging (or synchronising or even dualising) with Nights is not that good nor useful for the game outside of getting some blue sphere but that comparison with Superman 64 of all games is really far-fetching. Neither invented flying through circles...

Anywho, I wanted to link the NiGHTS storybook because I love the art style and it provides some backstory to how NiGHTS ended up in his prison:

NiGHTS Storybook ENGLISH « NiGHTS into Dreams .Com

I kinda miss the era of the story in the manual but in the other hand it also means that any re-releases without one would make it harder to get the full picture.

But then again the game is still good even if you don't get the entire story because it adds to the mystery and whimsical aspects of it.

 

[Badseed]

Bro, all you do is go into threads and shit on the game being discussed. Are you okay? Do you need a hug?

Post automatically merged: Jun 20, 2025

Anywho, I wanted to link the NiGHTS storybook because I love the art style and it provides some backstory to how NiGHTS ended up in his prison:

NiGHTS Storybook ENGLISH « NiGHTS into Dreams .Com

Ok. well I'm happy I have someone with nothing better to do than worry about what I'm up to. Look closer and you will see I only shit on one game (FF7) and one series (Nights). That's only because I don't like them. I apologize If I thought i lived in America where we value the right to individuality, being allowed to like what you like and most of all FREEDOM OF SPEECH (even if you don't like it!!)

Post automatically merged: Jun 20, 2025

You know that people have their opinions right?

You have yours (and I respect it since it's entirely subjective) but if your only argument doesn't go further than "In this game there are rings you travel in, Superman 64 has rings you travel in, therefore it's the same game" then it's no better than a fallacy about correlation.

Furthermore why telling "as a Saturn lover and an admitted Sega fanboy"? What does that change about what you're saying?

Finally your personal experience may be bad but 3 minutes doesn't even represent the entire game besides doing some paraloops in the first level's first route. It's like dropping Mario 64 right after entering the castle or even doing one level in Crash Bandicoot.

Fair Enough. But If I have to explain the fact that generally speaking the fan boys will buy and love anything put out by the particular company they idolize, well I don't know how to start. Also I have never played Mario64 or any Crash, maybe I'm the weird one. I will stick by my guns, The Nights series sucks SIMPLY BECAUSE I DONT LIKE IT! Nothing need more to be said. Different strokes for different folks baby!!

 

[Ikagura Ikagura]

Ok. well I'm happy I have someone with nothing better to do than worry about what I'm up to. Look closer and you will see I only shit on one game (FF7) and one series (Nights). That's only because I don't like them. I apologize If I thought i lived in America where we value the right to individuality, being allowed to like what you like and most of all FREEDOM OF SPEECH (even if you don't like it!!)

You know, disliking something and "shitting on" are two different things.

Also freedom of speech doesn't mean we're not allowed to disagree with you. If some people think that you're being rude about something then it's their right if you go by that.

Fair Enough. But If I have to explain the fact that generally speaking the fan boys will buy and love anything put out by the particular company they idolize, well I don't know how to start. Also I have never played Mario64 or any Crash, maybe I'm the weird one. I will stick by my guns, The Nights series sucks SIMPLY BECAUSE I DONT LIKE IT! Nothing need more to be said. Different strokes for different folks baby!!

The whole "I don't like it therefore it sucks" implies objectivity about your subjectivity...


There are classic games I'm not fan of but I cannot allow myself to think they're bad simply because I lack objectivity and cannot ignore their intrinsic qualities.

 

[Badseed]

You know, disliking something and "shitting on" are two different things.

Also freedom of speech doesn't mean we're not allowed to disagree with you. If some people think that you're being rude about something then it's their right if you go by that.


The whole "I don't like it therefore it sucks" implies objectivity about your subjectivity...


There are classic games I'm not fan of but I cannot allow myself to think they're bad simply because I lack objectivity and cannot ignore their intrinsic qualities.

Blah, blah. I was not put on this earth to like everything you or anyone else likes valuable or not. I'm sure some people feel that it is valuable to waste their time splitting hairs about what people comment. thank you for setting me straight sir. But I'll still go happily through life without a care in the world.

I cant believe I'm keeping this thread going all by my self. (though I would please like to move on at some point) Thank you for all the love friends

 

[solnK!]

Nights is peak.

 

[trickybus]

As for the same engine I cannot be sure as I don't find sources. Like how Rent a Hero may or may not reuse Phantasy Star II or III's engine but maybe some parts of the code may have been shared.

I kinda like when Sega references other games (especially outside of Sonic).

There are plenty like in Sonic Adventure DX and Adventure 2:

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In the first Sonic Riders:
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And a special quest in PSO Episode 1&2
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We could almost call Nights the sister series of Sonic.

To piggyback off this, there's another Sonic Adventure reference in the form of a special Chao form that involves maxing out the "Flying" stat and evolving it:

Really, the Chao Garden as a whole is connected to NiGHTS Into Dreams as it's a continuation of the A-Life system that dictates the behavior of the Pians. The following link is a 1996 interview with Yuji Naka briefly discussing the system.

Designing the A-Life System – 1996 Developer Interview - shmuplations.com

This short interview about the “A-Life” system from NiGHTS was originally featured in game hihyou magazine in 1996. Yuji Naka shares some valuable insight about the challenges of creating an “artificial life” system, as well as his thoughts about the need for more unique games like NiGHTS in the...

shmuplations.com

 

[Ikagura Ikagura]

To piggyback off this, there's another Sonic Adventure reference in the form of a special Chao form that involves maxing out the "Flying" stat and evolving it:

View attachment 83233

I forgot about that but I've barely played the Chao Garden side game.

I almost miss when Sega did nods to their other IPs.

In a way I could see Ristar as the "missing link" between Sonic and Nights (especially with his proto design featuring two horns)

Really, the Chao Garden as a whole is connected to NiGHTS Into Dreams as it's a continuation of the A-Life system that dictates the behavior of the Pians. The following link is a 1996 interview with Yuji Naka briefly discussing the system.

Designing the A-Life System – 1996 Developer Interview - shmuplations.com

This short interview about the “A-Life” system from NiGHTS was originally featured in game hihyou magazine in 1996. Yuji Naka shares some valuable insight about the challenges of creating an “artificial life” system, as well as his thoughts about the need for more unique games like NiGHTS in the...

shmuplations.com

I still like it conceptually: that A-Life system was also reused for the Mags in Phantasy Star Online.

I'm surprised that despite that the V-pet trend faded, they never had the idea to include it as a DSi-ware nor Smartphone app on iOS/Android.

 

[trickybus]

I'm surprised that despite that the V-pet trend faded, they never had the idea to include it as a DSi-ware nor Smartphone app on iOS/Android.

I remember reading somewhere that a Chao Garden spin-off game is one of the most requested ideas Sonic developers get. They're pretty vague about why it's never happened but if I had to hazard a guess, I'm thinking it has something to do with Yuji Naka being Yuji Naka.

 

[Ikagura Ikagura]

I remember reading somewhere that a Chao Garden spin-off game is one of the most requested ideas Sonic developers get. They're pretty vague about why it's never happened but if I had to hazard a guess, I'm thinking it has something to do with Yuji Naka being Yuji Naka.

I really got that love-hate thing going on with him and his decisions...

At least we're witnessing V-pet indie games

Such as Star Garden

Star Garden on Steam

Dive into an electrifying single-player story or take on thrilling multiplayer battles with up to four players locally or six online. Star Garden brings creature collection, exploration, and fast-paced action to life in stunning, dynamic worlds. Your interstellar adventure awaits!

store.steampowered.com

And Pogglings

Poglings on Steam

Evolve, breed, and race cute mysterious creatures known as Poglings. Stake claim to your island, grow your nest, and establish yourself as the best Pogling Hatcher the Wild Vine Islands has ever seen!

store.steampowered.com

Although I prefer the one more inspired by Kirby Air Ride but the more the merrier.

Back to Nights I've yet to see another game inspired by it gameplay wise...

At least we could hope to see a revival of 2.5D platformers akin to it, Klonoa and Kirby 64.

 

[trickybus]

I remember reading somewhere that a Chao Garden spin-off game is one of the most requested ideas Sonic developers get.

Found it. Damn you, Iizuka!

Post automatically merged: Jun 22, 2025

Back to Nights I've yet to see another game inspired by it gameplay wise...

I swear that was supposed to be Balan Wonderworld but Yuji had to strike again

 

[Ikagura Ikagura]

Found it. Damn you, Iizuka!

I still agree that the garden is great because you do levels to get the animals/chaos drives to power up your Chao so in a way it would be hard to implement ways to do activities other than raising them.

Sonic Advance 1&2 and Pinball Party had the Tiny Chao Garden which was meant to allow to share stuff even if two players had different games and it should be possible to do it between two phones next to each-others via bluetooth.

Aside from that I still genuinely feel that Iizuka should step down as the director for

I swear that was supposed to be Balan Wonderworld but Yuji had to strike again

Ah yes, the Mighty N°9 of Naka and why even a spiritual successor from the original authors aren't necessarily good.

I'd still say that I wish we could see a proper 2.5D arcade game than an exploration 3D game like Balan.

I feel they tried to do the thing that appealed to the broad audience when it was a niche part that wanted more action.

Even Journey of Dream adding missions and story bits to make the game longer missed the point (as much as I actually liked the main levels of that game).

 

[trickybus]

story bits

Which the Sonic Team really needs to stop doing because creative writing is not their strong suit. I believe NiGHTS is a stronger IP with a simple story.

 

[Ikagura Ikagura]

Which the Sonic Team really needs to stop doing because creative writing is not their strong suit. I believe NiGHTS is a stronger IP with a simple story.

Or keep the lore and story in manuals and comics (maybe).


JoD had good ideas but ultimately the story is the kind you'd watch once then skip them the next time you play and honestly the side missions shouldn't have been mandatory to advance in the game. If there was any re-release or remaster I'd like if you could just do 2 missions to be allowed to tackle the next level instead of the same chain link one with that octopus or having a harder version of the boss as the final mission when the regular level should have put the harder boss by default.

The Sonic Team can do nice stories but that's mostly a narration issue and putting it in the game design.

 

[trickybus]

The Sonic Team can do nice stories but that's mostly a narration issue and putting it in the game design.

I'm probably being too harsh; when SA2 came out, the overall narrative and character backstories were some of the dumbest things I'd ever heard. It's only the one game but I think the grudge is still there

I think you hit the nail on the head regarding why Sonic Team stumbles over narrative: they struggle with marrying the gameplay and the story. It's why I'd rather they focus on ensuring a fun experience and worry about an excuse plot later.

 

[Ikagura Ikagura]

I think you hit the nail on the head regarding why Sonic Team stumbles over narrative: they struggle with marrying the gameplay and the story. It's why I'd rather they focus on ensuring a fun experience and worry about an excuse plot later.

Absolutely. I didn't mind the story being shown from another perspective (like in the Sonic two Raiders game showing the Team Babylon's side of the events) but if it ends up like Sonic Heroes where you had to play the levels four times it's a big no.


Nights kinda managed to make both characters having different level although I do wish they had slight stats variations (like Eliot being slower but with better turning) but I always felt like Claris was easy/normal mode whole Eliot was normal/hard mode with his levels (especially Stick Canyon).

Unfortunately the fact that the last level is the same for both so it felt a bit redundant instead of just doing one final level for both characters.

Yes I know, Claris wasn't even supposed to be in Twin Seeds (the internal name is called "SPIRAL-CLARIS" in the game's files while Eliot's last level was "ELIOT'S-CITY" aka Twin Seeds).

 

[TamagotchiTamaHero24's icon TamagotchiTamaHero24 TamagotchiTamaHero24]

Unfortunately the fact that the last level is the same for both so it felt a bit redundant instead of just doing one final level for both characters.

I don’t really have an issue with the final level being SIMILAR for both, but it would have been cool if they were different in a way that showcased each kid’s specific issues. But that’s water under the bridge because the final level plays amazing.

 

[Ikagura Ikagura]

I don’t really have an issue with the final level being SIMILAR for both, but it would have been cool if they were different in a way that showcased each kid’s specific issues. But that’s water under the bridge because the final level plays amazing.

I just think it's redundant.

Shame Sega hasn't made a "director's cut" version including the missing stuff.

That's why I find Bellbridge in JoD a bit more interesting in this aspect.

 

[TamagotchiTamaHero24's icon TamagotchiTamaHero24 TamagotchiTamaHero24]

I was just now listening to the “original soundtrack” disc. Realized: the arrangements on there might be the original arrangements. They sound different from the tracks in the final game, using different synths and instrument samples. There’s also the main theme CLEARLY being performed by an actual orchestra when I’m pretty sure it’s midi in the game itself.