Features you hate in franchises that you love

[RageBurner]

Yes, love, hate! we have to be strongly opinionated, it's all about passion! brrrr!

Anyway, now that that is out of my system, what I'd like to discuss is what the title alludes to. We all have franchises we hold close to our chests due to a variety of reasons, but time and time again something happens to 'em that creates an unpleasant experience somehow or ends up working against the style and feel you enjoy and are used to.

I'll start then:

Moster Hunter World was something of a revelation to most: it was the first time the series reached the global arena and it was met with an explosive amount of success, making it instantly recognizable and strongly associated with Capcom, whereas until that point it was much more of a niche experience that one either loved or knew nothing about (I am on the former camp).

As is usual with this series, after a new game lands, an expanded version comes along, sometimes 2, 3 years later or so that introduces more content and a whole new tier of difficulty level, making for essentially the complete experience.

In Monster Hunter World's case, that took the form of Monster Hunter World: Iceborne, bringing with it new areas, monsters, and mechanics.

Crucially, it's a mechanical change that I want to focus on, here, one that is highly divisive among hunters, the Clutch Claw. It's an accessory (that is mandatory, mind you) that you fire at a monster to grapple onto it and attack its body to temporarily weaken parts of it.

On paper, that makes perfect sense, but it created a myriad of knock on effects, throwing off balance established by the base version of the game completely and all but requiring the use of this mechanic by late game to make any real progress, not to mention it completely breaks the normal flow of the combat.

Not everyone minds the claw. Some are okay with it, some love it, some detest it. I detest it.

So much so that the only reason why I even play MH World, despite how great and important it was and still is, is because there is a mod that rebalances the whole game in a way the gimmick is no longer necessary to make the game viable.

Anyway, that's me, that's my passion, brrr!

 

[Tonberry]

View attachment 12537

the Clutch Claw. It's an accessory (that is mandatory, mind you) that you fire at a monster to grapple onto it and attack its body to temporarily weaken parts of it.

I just saw the image and knew exactly what you were gonna mention, and I'm right there with you.
Clutch Claw broke too much of the immersion, as did other stuff in Iceborne. Defeating a monster turned into a checklist of things you had to do to it, rather than just beating it in a fight. World already introduced enough good variety in how to do that, I feel.

Mine is kind of weird, but I think Silent Hill 2 would have been a much better game (I still love it) if it didn't have combat. It's so poorly implemented, and if you don't realize that it's usually better to just skip enemies, you'll end up with a kill count of 300 on a first playthrough.
I think it mainly stems from it being an old game, and simply omitting combat (in a game that is all about suspense and exploration) would've been seen as madness at that time. I think it hampers the experience more than it elevates it, though.

If there's one thing I'll applaud modern horror games for, it's taking a page out of Clock Tower's book and ditching or minimizing combat, in favour of battles of wit and resourcefulness or simply knowing how best to escape threats.

 

[Yousef]

Fantastic idea my cop buddy. I’ll now say stuff I hate in every franchise I hold near and dear to my heart.

In Mega Man, wily castles are consistently lackluster for me. Still not sure why.
In musous, I think the grindness can actually be toned down but I doubt Koei will ever agree.
In max payne, I think dual wielding is a bit… weird? Real rendered bullets are hit or miss.
In dark souls, bosses are kinda my least favorite part :/ I prefer exploration and character building
In sonic, extremely short stages are- actually I don’t hold sonic close to my heart, thats giving him too much credit
In kingdom hearts- nah I’m kidding again
In call of duty, I’d refer a clearer mission strtcture
In wrestling games, I’d prefer shorter storylines, your character also walks way too slow in hub worlds
In GTA, I think I want more ammo and weapons.

 

[Logi]

Mine is kind of weird, but I think Silent Hill 2 would have been a much better game (I still love it) if it didn't have combat. It's so poorly implemented, and if you don't realize that it's usually better to just skip enemies, you'll end up with a kill count of 300 on a first playthrough.
I think it mainly stems from it being an old game, and simply omitting combat (in a game that is all about suspension and exploration) would've been seen as madness at that time. I think it hampers the experience more than it elevates it, though.

If there's one thing I'll applaud modern horror games for, it's taking a page out of Clock Tower's book and ditching or minimizing combat, in favour of battles of wit and resourcefulness or simply knowing how best to escape threats.
View attachment 12538

I am 100% in favor of combat in these games and being clunky and poorly implemented is a plus for me. Having an actual good combat makes it less scary as you feel more in control of the situation. That being said i do avoid all enemies but they being there and being able to damage me if i play poorly gives me a sense of "i have to focus otherwise i'm dead"

 

[fake-kun]

i hate him

 

[Tonberry]

View attachment 12542
i hate him

I will never not do the Elecman pause thing against this guy
Wily peaked then and there

 

[Yousef]

View attachment 12542
i hate him

Valid

 

[juan19]

Yes, love, hate! we have to be strongly opinionated, it's all about passion! brrrr!

Anyway, now that that is out of my system, what I'd like to discuss is what the title alludes to. We all have franchises we hold close to our chests due to a variety of reasons, but time and time again something happens to 'em that creates an unpleasant experience somehow or ends up working against the style and feel you enjoy and are used to.

I'll start then:

View attachment 12537

Moster Hunter World was something of a revelation to most: it was the first time the series reached the global arena and it was met with an explosive amount of success, making it instantly recognizable and strongly associated with Capcom, whereas until that point it was much more of a niche experience that one either loved or knew nothing about (I am on the former camp).

As is usual with this series, after a new game lands, an expanded version comes along, sometimes 2, 3 years later or so that introduces more content and a whole new tier of difficulty level, making for essentially the complete experience.

In Monster Hunter World's case, that took the form of Monster Hunter World: Iceborne, bringing with it new areas, monsters, and mechanics.

Crucially, it's a mechanical change that I want to focus on, here, one that is highly divisive among hunters, the Clutch Claw. It's an accessory (that is mandatory, mind you) that you fire at a monster to grapple onto it and attack its body to temporarily weaken parts of it.

On paper, that makes perfect sense, but it created a myriad of knock on effects, throwing off balance established by the base version of the game completely and all but requiring the use of this mechanic by late game to make any real progress, not to mention it completely breaks the normal flow of the combat.

Not everyone minds the claw. Some are okay with it, some love it, some detest it. I detest it.

So much so that the only reason why I even play MH World, despite how great and important it was and still is, is because there is a mod that rebalances the whole game in a way the gimmick is no longer necessary to make the game viable.

Anyway, that's me, that's my passion, brrr!

dont talk like a white 2012 videogame critic

 

[Cu-Neo]

I remember that in the 7th generation a lot of games had unskippable cutscenes. Games like God Of War 3 and Max Payne 3 are the ones to come to my mind. Both are great games but it's horrible when you replay them in higher difficulties, you die and then you have to watch that long cutscene again.

 

[Yousef]

I remember that in the 7th generation a lot of games had unskippable cutscenes. Games like God Of War 3 and Max Payne 3 are the ones to come to my mind. Both are great games but it's horrible when you replay them in higher difficulties, you die and then you have to watch that long cutscene again.

I literally can’t reply max payne 3 cuz of the cutscenes and find max payne gba to be a more valid part of the “trilogy” simply cuz of this looooooooool

 

[RageBurner]

I just saw the image and knew exactly what you were gonna mention, and I'm right there with you.
Clutch Claw broke too much of the immersion, as did other stuff in Iceborne. Defeating a monster turned into a checklist of things you had to do to it, rather than just beating it in a fight. World already introduced enough good variety in how to do that, I feel.

Mine is kind of weird, but I think Silent Hill 2 would have been a much better game (I still love it) if it didn't have combat. It's so poorly implemented, and if you don't realize that it's usually better to just skip enemies, you'll end up with a kill count of 300 on a first playthrough.
I think it mainly stems from it being an old game, and simply omitting combat (in a game that is all about suspense and exploration) would've been seen as madness at that time. I think it hampers the experience more than it elevates it, though.

If there's one thing I'll applaud modern horror games for, it's taking a page out of Clock Tower's book and ditching or minimizing combat, in favour of battles of wit and resourcefulness or simply knowing how best to escape threats.
View attachment 12538

You perfectly understand my stance on tye claw, thank you!
While im bad at survival horror and barely played any in my life, from watching playthroughs I have to agree that puzzle like combat is tye best way to do it.

I also feel that a lot of the time character differentiation is poorly made and not a real factor. I can understand Jennifer being all but helpless, but by contrast Jill and Chris should have better reflexes than that.

I'm mostly poking fun mind you.

Fantastic idea my copy buddy. I’ll now say stuff I hate in every franchise I hold near and dear to my heart.

In Mega Man, wily castles are consistently lackluster for me. Still not sure why.
In musous, I think the grindness can actually be toned down but I doubt Koei will ever agree.
In max payne, I think dual wielding is a bit… weird? Real rendered bullets are hit or miss.
In dark souls, bosses are kinda my least favorite part :/ I prefer exploration and character building
In sonic, extremely short stages are- actually I don’t hold sonic close to my heart, thats giving him too much credit
In kingdom hearts- nah I’m kidding again
In call of duty, I’d refer a clearer mission strtcture
In wrestling games, I’d prefer shorter storylines, your character also walks way too slow in hub worlds
In GTA, I think I want more ammo and weapons.

- Wily castles are boring because they have no real theme, they are just death room after death room of everything the game had.

- Musou grind is inevitable, it's part of what keeps the player invested.

- No real opinions on Max Payne. The pun is a classic, though.

- Sonic zones feel short because the game is dynamic and lively.

- I'm the opposite. I hate the exploration and prefer bosses.

- I don't really play military FPS games or wrestling games.

- There's never enough ammo or guns, ever.

 

[Yousef]

You perfectly understand my stance on tye claw, thank you!
While im bad at survival horror and barely played any in my life, from watching playthroughs I have to agree that puzzle like combat is tye best way to do it.

I also feel that a lot of the time character differentiation is poorly made and not a real factor. I can understand Jennifer being all but helpless, but by contrast Jill and Chris should have better reflexes than that.

I'm mostly poking fun mind you.


- Wily castles are boring because they have no real theme, they are just death room after death room of everything the game had.

- Musou grind is inevitable, it's part of what keeps the player invested.

- No real opinions on Max Payne. The pun is a classic, though.

- Sonic zones feel short because the game is dynamic and lively.

- I'm the opposite. I hate the exploration and prefer bosses.

- I don't really play military FPS games or wrestling games.

- There's never enough ammo or guns, ever.

Thank you for ignoring KH.

 

[Inkingsama]

The demon negotiation in SMT is bullshit. It comes down to luck: at best you walk away with a new demon but now your wallet is empty, at worst you get robbed or killed.

 

[Yousef]

The demon negotiation in SMT is bullshit. It comes down to luck:

This is factually true. I checked a guide and it was unhelpful.

 

[Tonberry]

The demon negotiation in SMT is bullshit. It comes down to luck: at best you walk away with a new demon but now your wallet is empty, at worst you get robbed or killed.

I thought the answers depended on the tribe of the demon in question paired with the moon phases? Could’ve sworn there were patterns to learn, at least in some of the modern ones.
But then again I’m just now getting into SMT so maybe I haven’t reached the boiling point with their fickleness lol

Edit: It seems to be slightly more straightforward in V, but very random in older games yeah.

 

[RageBurner]

The demon negotiation in SMT is bullshit. It comes down to luck: at best you walk away with a new demon but now your wallet is empty, at worst you get robbed or killed.

True, for a core mechanic, it's not well realized. Soul Hackers adds personalites which deepens things a bit, but ends up being another thing to memorize.

 

[Bakuma1997]

Oh boy...

Megaman: While i like the Wily Castles, i find Wily (And Sigma in X) to be overused, come on Capcom even Zelda can use anything besides Ganon

Zelda: Speaking of Zelda, the priority of Lore and puzzles over the combat made the games easy, Good Lord the spin-offs kept it fresh pre BOTW

Mario: While they are great, i will be the first one to note the elephant: 2D games are formulatic and samey, haven't played Wonder (Which i heard it did an Odyssey to the 2D series) but for me the last worthy 2D game is New Super Mario Wii... and maybe Maker if you count spinoffs

Pokemon: Ummmn Pokemon Company, maybe people will stop hating your franchise if you allowed Game Freak to: A) Let them improve the engine B) give them time and C) FOCUS ON THE GAME'S QUALITY INSTEAD OF GIMMICS AND INFLATING THE POKEDEX

Megaten: The games are already hard by themselves, WHO THE FUCK WAS THE GENIUS THAT THOUGH UNBLOCKABLE ATTACKS IN LATE GAME BOSSES WAS A GOOD IDEA!?

Touhou: The game punishes you already depriving you of a good ending by continuing, ¿Why punish even further by only giving three continues? I am not in the lore so i don't mind the good ending

Silent Hill: The Cult Plot, i think Silent Hill would be better as a Anthology, if they wanted the Mason's story closed make 3 the second game and make 3 onwards to have only Silent Hill as common theme

Etrian Odyssey: HOW...SLOW...THE...FIRST...STRATUM...IS
i get RPGs are slow in their beggining by proxy, but this games have no chill telling you "Here you got only 500 golds and 3 Skill points, good luck figuring out how to get past the enemies of the second floor without reaching level 10 just to be strong enough to not die in 3 turns" *Cocks gun, calms down and gets it off his temple* fortunately playing your cards right will net you broken units, but the first four or so floors are the reason i barely replay them or cheat to get 10 levels

And Finally... ̶C̶a̶r̶l̶o̶s̶ ̶e̶l̶ ̶t̶o̶p̶o̶ ̶q̶u̶e̶ ̶g̶i̶r̶a̶ Crash Bandicoot: How they masacred the 100% post 3, first game is inthable to do, the second did every single thing right, allowing a better system, rewarding outside box thinking (The blue gem rewards noticing you can beat the level it is in without box breaking) and feeling organic, 3... i would not minded Time Trials if they were a post game bonus AFTER getting 100%, but they made 3 a chore, not only that, ¿Remember that fun to find secret exit and No-death shortcut mechanic in 2? Gone to priorize getting a certain number of time trials, worse, you have to clear the game at least once to get a CHANCE to beat the non-vehicle ones, oh, the vehicles also made a chore to get 100% in future games, the pig/bear riding levels in 1 and 2 were annoying to gem clear, but at least they were never more than 3 per game, but 3 Onwards you will find at least 2/3 of the levels taken by a vehicle gimmick that makes breaking the boxes more a chore than a challenge

Post automatically merged: Jan 15, 2025

The demon negotiation in SMT is bullshit. It comes down to luck: at best you walk away with a new demon but now your wallet is empty, at worst you get robbed or killed.

I hate how acurrate it is

 

[moonbits]

Why is it always "hate" with these topics lately. Anyways, I am not fond of the rage arts in Tekken 7/8

 

[RageBurner]

Why is it always "hate" with these topics lately. Anyways, I am not fond of the rage arts in Tekken 7/8

I was being playfully bombastic on purpose.

 

[Stookymalarkey]

It's the BUMP combat system in the Ys series. I get why the first two games had it (memory limitations on the PC-8801) but it's still terrible. Enemies turn too quickly so it's hard to tell when you're attacking their front or side(which determines if they're attacking you or not), and the bosses require too much trial and error to avoid damage. I was barely able to beat Ys 2 and had to drop Ys 1 since the final boss drops bits of the floor during battle AND you don't have a jump button, making it easy to get trapped and die. I'm glad it got left behind after Ys 4.

 

[Leifang]

Why is it always "hate" with these topics lately. Anyways, I am not fond of the rage arts in Tekken 7/8

As someone who got into fighting games on PS1, all power bars in general UNLESS they use a dedicated button. I hate it when I literally cannot use a super without a command list.

 

[miguk]

• Pokemon — I want to play these games again, but the moment they say "Pikachu is trying to learn Kreigenwerfer but can't because he's too dumb to remember more than 4 things. What should he forget?", I zone out and eventually quit because I have no clue what that move is and the game makes no attempt to tell me what it does. How hard is it to just let the Morónmon learn the whole moveset?
• King of Fighters and other SNK fighting games — The pretzel move is just dumb and should have been removed by now. They ditched it for Mark of the Wolves, but brought it back later for no good reason.
• Xenoblade — Sometimes the fast travel points you need to use the most are too far from various missions and frequently-traveled-to areas. Xenoblade X was the worse culprit.
• Dungeon crawlers/ blobbers (in general) — 90% of them have the same big moment of anxiety at the beginning: does this thing have a mapping system or not? Granted, it's getting better these days, but there's still no guarantee they did the proper QoL, and retro ones are a toss-up.

 

[Waffles]

I don't know if this has changed since I played the games last (in the fifth generation), but I absolutely hated the sheer amount of story interruptions disguised as plot devises on Pokemon, particularly the way they'd have you stopping death on your tracks just to have some BS three-way video call with the professor and the rival. It got so bad that I almost didn't finish Black & White 1.

But then again, Pokemon loves to interrupt you for no reason, kinda like how Sonic would stop being about going extremely fast just to have you do some slow puzzling. I call it "Flow Breaker".

 

[RageBurner]

But then again, Pokemon loves to interrupt you for no reason, kinda like how Sonic would stop being about going extremely fast just to have you do some slow puzzling. I call it "Flow Breaker".

Remember random youngsters calling you in the dead of night to talk about Rattatas?

 

[Waffles]

Remember random youngsters calling you in the dead of night to talk about Rattatas?

LOL! I would often travel to wherever they were just to kill their entire parties XD