News Duckstation dev blocks Arch Linux users, threatens to completely remove Linux support

[aquova]

Scripts: Remove PKGBUILD · stenzek/duckstation@30df16c

I originally provided this an alternative to the broken AUR packages. However, it seems that Arch users would rather use broken packages and keep complaining to me instead of their packager. I spe...

github.com

There's quite a bit of history here with the developer's frustration with Linux users and open source in general. Between libretro forking Duckstation to create Swanstation, him changing the license (possibly illegally) to a rather restrictive one prevent such behavior, then growing frustrated when users would complain about issues in their unofficial builds -- unofficial because they can't use his now-proprietary build scripts. I'm unclear on whether he's just threatening to remove Linux support, or it's actually happening in the coming days.

 

[thecrow2313]

Something like that happen to Flycast emulator for iOS users were complaining and harassing even sending death threats.

 

[jankusanagi jankusanagi]

Pffffffff!!

To that I say:

 

[KenShjIN]

Who uses Linux anyway ?

 

[thecrow2313]

Who uses Linux anyway ?

Some use Win10, 11. Many use different distros of Linux here.

 

[emotion_engine]

wow. i haven't used a ps1 emu in a while, but i liked how neat and simple duckstation was. not sure if im on the dev's side or the users'. on the one hand, i really don't get this business about his license not allowing him to make packages; from what i understand, it's some kind of installer? i have extremely limited experience with ubuntu, so this is all greek to me. On the other hand, linux users pestering him to fix versions he has no involvement in is just ridiculous behavior. that kind of attitude is what gets promising projects shelved.

 

[Phage]

Oh goody, another emu developer/rom hacker/homebrew coder pitching a hissy fit over drama that they created.

I'm hoping this turns out to be just a moment of frustration, but as someone who's been around the CFW/console/rom hacking scene for a couple decades, I've seen this song and dance before. Someone creates a great piece of programming, gets an inflated sense of importance, then starts lashing out at anyone who has the tiniest complaint before eventually going closed source, "forbidding" anyone to replicate their work, then eventually taking their ball and going home by deleting their files and leaving the scene. Really hope this isn't the precursor to a similar situation.

 

[MajesticSiN]

Damn is he always getting mad about something?

 

[thecrow2313]

wow. i haven't used a ps1 emu in a while, but i liked how neat and simple duckstation was. not sure if im on the dev's side or the users'. on the one hand, i really don't get this business about his license not allowing him to make packages; from what i understand, it's some kind of installer? i have extremely limited experience with ubuntu, so this is all greek to me. On the other hand, linux users pestering him to fix versions he has no involvement in is just ridiculous behavior. that kind of attitude is what gets promising projects shelved.

What I noticed for DuckStation for Windows it has an updater that downloads the update and installs it. For Linux for example Linux Mint you have to download the appimage manually via github.

 

[monomario]

What I noticed for DuckStation for Windows it has an updater that downloads the update and installs it. For Linux for example Linux Mint you have to download the flatpak or appimage manually via github.

Only the first time, once installed, it updates automatically (at least the appimage)

 

[thecrow2313]

Scripts: Remove PKGBUILD · stenzek/duckstation@30df16c

I originally provided this an alternative to the broken AUR packages. However, it seems that Arch users would rather use broken packages and keep complaining to me instead of their packager. I spe...

github.com

There's quite a bit of history here with the developer's frustration with Linux users and open source in general. Between libretro forking Duckstation to create Swanstation, him changing the license (possibly illegally) to a rather restrictive one prevent such behavior, then growing frustrated when users would complain about issues in their unofficial builds -- unofficial because they can't use his now-proprietary build scripts. I'm unclear on whether he's just threatening to remove Linux support, or it's actually happening in the coming days.

Basically arguing towards Linux users. Is it user error? Is he afraid his code will be stolen and forked?
Sounds very serious.

 

[Number V]

I think the biggest consequence of this, if the dev does actually go through with removing Linux support, would affect handhelds and EmulationStation distros. All those manufacturers like Anbernic, Retroid, etc. and anyone who is running an OS like Batocera or Rocknix suddenly loses access to updates to Duckstation. PS1 emulation is already in a pretty good spot and they would keep their existing versions of Duckstation at least, just no new updates going forward.

 

[JustCallMeConstantin]

Who uses Linux anyway ?

I

 

[aquova]

wow. i haven't used a ps1 emu in a while, but i liked how neat and simple duckstation was. not sure if im on the dev's side or the users'. on the one hand, i really don't get this business about his license not allowing him to make packages; from what i understand, it's some kind of installer? i have extremely limited experience with ubuntu, so this is all greek to me. On the other hand, linux users pestering him to fix versions he has no involvement in is just ridiculous behavior. that kind of attitude is what gets promising projects shelved.

Arch Linux offers a service known as the AUR ("Arch User Repository") where anyone can upload installer scripts for others to use. Many of these scripts are completely independent of the project they're supporting, it's just a user out there who wants to make it easier to install.

From what I understand, in an attempt to cut down on the number of bug reports that were simply due to the program being installed wrong, the dev explicitly said that he will only support certain installation methods on Linux -- such as a Flatpak or AppImage. He also created his own version of the AUR install script, which he explicitly said was the only method on Arch he'll support.

Where it gets weird is that because the developer created that script as part of the project, and the project as a whole has a (rather restrictive) license, the install script he made couldn't actually be uploaded to the AUR, which mandates that all scripts be licensed as 0BSD (which is about as close to public domain as you can get with software). So, an unofficial script (more than one I think actually) has been maintained on the AUR. Which, the dev isn't happy about because he keeps getting bug reports related to an installation method he didn't authorize.

 

[JustCallMeConstantin]

No wonder why Arch Linux Have toxic community

 

[thecrow2313]

I think the biggest consequence of this, if the dev does actually go through with removing Linux support, would affect handhelds and EmulationStation distros. All those manufacturers like Anbernic, Retroid, etc. and anyone who is running an OS like Batocera or Rocknix suddenly loses access to updates to Duckstation. PS1 emulation is already in a pretty good spot and they would keep their existing versions of Duckstation at least, just no new updates going forward.

If this happens will SwanStation be dead for Libretro??

 

[Number V]

If this happens will SwanStation be dead for Libretro??

No, Swanstation would remain as is in Libretro. It's a fork of Duckstation from before the dev switched the license, and it doesn't receive any updates from Duckstation as is.

 

[thecrow2313]

This happened last year

Creator Of PS1 Emulator DuckStation Threatens To "Shut The Whole Thing Down" Following License Change

"I don't appreciate the threats"

www.timeextension.com

 

[Leon]

Sorry but as a arch linux type distro user, this guy is acting like a child.
If he doesn't like it, there's a easy fix, shut out bug fix requests, most people are probably iffy about using duckstation after he made it proprietary anyway.

Post automatically merged: Today at 5:10 AM

Who uses Linux anyway ?

5% of the world's desktop using population according to stat tracker, or around 200m if we go with about 4 billion people, so not exactly a small amount.
Keep in mind that's just according to stat tracker, it's likely much higher in countries like russia.

 

[otogirisou]

this emulator keep getting regressed on every update. time to reinstall bleem.

 

[thecrow2313]

this emulator keep getting regressed on every update. time to reinstall bleem.

Remember this?

Welcome to the official ePSXe website

The very worst one

 

[Waffles's iconWaffles]

Damn.

Reminds me of what had happened to a certain Nintendo DS emulator that got the dev frustrated to the point of abandoning it.

 

[Morgana Veil]

Oh... oh no, what will we ever do without DuckStation on Linux. Not like there are any other PS1 emulators for Linux. Woe is us, poor Tux lovers...

PCSX-Reloaded
Mednafen (PlayStation Module)
ePSXe (via Wine)
PCSX-Redux

The developer has always had a serious hair up his ass with Linux and DuckStation. I agree that it's a good emulator, but the creator really needs to pull the stick out of his ass, and stop being so uptight about it

 

[A man on a computer]

Oh fucking well... time to switch back to Mednafen's Beatle.

 

[Graw]

Where it gets weird is that because the developer created that script as part of the project, and the project as a whole has a (rather restrictive) license, the install script he made couldn't actually be uploaded to the AUR, which mandates that all scripts be licensed as 0BSD (which is about as close to public domain as you can get with software). So, an unofficial script (more than one I think actually) has been maintained on the AUR. Which, the dev isn't happy about because he keeps getting bug reports related to an installation method he didn't authorize.

Seems like the easiest solution would be to just license his own build script under the BSD license. I don't understand why he would throw a fit instead of doing that. It's just a build script.